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Nightlatch and composite door

Discussion in 'Windows and Doors' started by iluap, 9 Sep 2021.

  1. iluap

    iluap

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    Hello,

    We have moved recently and the new house has a UPVC or composite door (not sure which one) with a multipoint lock. We need to use a key to lock the door at night because it can be opened from outside using the handle but we keep on forgetting it.
    I am considering installing a nightlatch but this does not seem to be common with this type of door. I understand I'd have to use a holesaw and wondering if this will compromise the door.
    Any ideas?
     
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  3. phatboy

    phatboy

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    Can you just get a dead handle and a split spindle for the outside?
     
  4. iluap

    iluap

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    I could do that but it'd be good to have the option to be able to open the door from outside if working at the front. A dead handle and split spindle could cost approximately the same as a yale/night latch too.
     
  5. ronniecabers

    ronniecabers

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    Im a bit confused ... you wish to put a night latch on , that you would need a key to open it with ... a ' pad / lever handle ' for a split spindle would do exactly the same, you'd need the key to open it from outside. All the split spindle does is disable the handle, you then turn the key to turn the existing multipoint lock night catch to access the property. You would need to remove the exsiting handle to check you have two spindle holes though. And as to whether it would compromise the door? depends on the type of door to be honest ... another factor to consider is whether the door is in warranty, if you go drilling into it for a lock , then warranty voided ... new handle shouldn't effect any warranty as near enough all new multipoint locks are designed with a split spindle
     
  6. phatboy

    phatboy

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    That's what I was thinking in my above post too... cannot see the difference in functionality.....

    @iluap , with a pad handle, you can still open the door from outside using a key.... you just turn the key a bit more and it releases the door. Try it now, it's the same as dropping the handle to enter.
     
  7. iluap

    iluap

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    I understand this is confusing. Let me explain it better since I may not have been clear before:

    The door works the same from inside or outside, i.e. closing the door and lifting the handle from either side will engage the multipoint locking system, lowering the handle from either side will disengage it, turning the key from either side will lock the door (we forget to do this at night often, hence the original question). If we don't lock the door, anyone could open it from outside.

    With a nightlatch, we would make it somewhat more secure when closing the door (I know we would need to lock it too to make it even safer) but we would also have the option to disable it if we need to do some gardening/DIY outside by lowering the handle and pushing down the snib and not locking the door, i.e. we could still open it from outside without using a key either in the main handle lock or the nightlatch lock.

    I checked again and could not see the main spindle hole being partitioned to use a split spindle but saw other ones which I have no idea what they are for, please see the attached piccie. The one currently in use is the third from top, the 2nd and 4th I have no clue what they are for.

    Also, checking the door it seems the main body is good quality wood and the outer layer is plastic, so a composite door. We have no paperwork regarding the warranty of it so, not sure we could claim anything at all...
     

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  9. ronniecabers

    ronniecabers

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    Right... Firstly thats a composite door you have there by the looks of it. Secondly , by using a split spindle (Lever /pad handle ) you will not be able to engage the multipoint locks nightlatch from outside , but would be able to do so with the key , from inside the handle would work as before. The way the split spindle works is by utilising BOTH spindle holes (middle holes of your picture ). If you take your current handle off and put the existing spindle in the other hole to where it is now and operate the handle you will see that the downward motion of the handle does not operate the ' latch ', but turning the key does. What happens with a split spindle handle (lever / Pad Handle )is that one spindle goes in the top hole , and one in the bottom spindle hole, thus giving you a split spindle effect. From memoery top hole is internal handle/spindle , bottom hole is external handle/spindle
     
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  10. ronniecabers

    ronniecabers

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    just noticed should have stressed , use holes 3 and 4
     
  11. JohnD

    JohnD

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    are the uppermost (small) ones for a latch holdback snib? I have something with a faint resemblance.
     
  12. iluap

    iluap

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    Ok, I think I am getting there: hole number 4 operates the multilock but not the mortice latch, i.e. from outside, moving up and down the handle, moves the spindle in number 4 and this engages/disengages the hooks of the multilock but I'd need to use the key to retract basic latch. Is that correct?
    If so, you guys are suggesting a dual spindle (just found out what its name is!).
    If the 2nd hole in the picture is for a snib so it can lock the latch from inside without using a key, that be great!
    I found this set "Balmoral Sprung Offset Snib Lever Pad Door Handle" but someone complained in amazon the snib didn't do anything (it does not say whether the set comes with a little spindle for the snib). Any recommendations? I'll obviously make sure the measurements are correct.
     
  13. ronniecabers

    ronniecabers

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    That sounds right.

    The snib would be hole 2 , and what that would do is keep the ' latch ' retracted so that the door doesn't latch behind you if you went outside without the key.
    I can't comment how good or not the handles you have seen are , it may be a case of the person who wrote that review didn't actually have the facility for a snib on the mutlipoint locks gearbox....not all do
     
  14. iluap

    iluap

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    Many thanks for your help everyone! Basically you explained the door does not need an extra night latch since it is already available, it's only a matter of changing the handle set.
     
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