These "modern" flat screens all have jerky fast motion. (no interlaced scan) I'm hanging on to my old panasonic CRT version until it packs up!
lukewarmbath
lukewarmbath
Non CRT screens suffer from not having interlaced scan
- Thread starter lukewarmbath
- Start date
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A
Alarm
"All" Ehhh.......................Sweeping expert opinion there then.
Fully backed up with lots of technical data.
Fully backed up with lots of technical data.
C
ChrisFrost
Err.... Thanks for sharing (?)
They have twice as many lines to make up for lack of interlace. It has nothing to do with jerky motion. That's caused by the dynamic compression used before transmission to reduce bandwidth. HDTV is far less prone to it.
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Perhaps lukewarmbath has a valid point...
Me and my better half have looked at scores of LCD TV's over the past year with a view to purchase. Trouble is that every one we've viewed appeared to suffer motion blur to a greater or lesser extent.
Frustrated by this, I posted a question on a popular AV forum. I asked if there was a 32" to 37" LCD TV that didn't suffer from some degree of motion blur. Despite over 300 "views", not one single recomendation. What does that say? Next, I searched for 'motion blur' in the TV forum and received 472 hits (I didn't view every single post - even I haven't got that much time on my hands - so I'm not suggesting that every single hit represented an LCD TV motion blur problem but many certainly did).
I've read articles that suggest motion blur is a psychosomatic effect and that some folks won't experience it but seeing as I can't change my brain (unfortunately) it may be that I have to wait for new developments in TV.
It's true that we could probably grow accustomed to it - as we probably have got used to distortions on my old CRT TV - but I'm reluctant to spend big on an LCD TV when one very important aspect of picture quality (for us) is significantly worse than an old CRT TV.
Please, please, please recommend me an LCD TV (32 to 37", up to £1k) that you feel doesn't suffer motion blur and I will endevour to view it.
Me and my better half have looked at scores of LCD TV's over the past year with a view to purchase. Trouble is that every one we've viewed appeared to suffer motion blur to a greater or lesser extent.
Frustrated by this, I posted a question on a popular AV forum. I asked if there was a 32" to 37" LCD TV that didn't suffer from some degree of motion blur. Despite over 300 "views", not one single recomendation. What does that say? Next, I searched for 'motion blur' in the TV forum and received 472 hits (I didn't view every single post - even I haven't got that much time on my hands - so I'm not suggesting that every single hit represented an LCD TV motion blur problem but many certainly did).
I've read articles that suggest motion blur is a psychosomatic effect and that some folks won't experience it but seeing as I can't change my brain (unfortunately) it may be that I have to wait for new developments in TV.
It's true that we could probably grow accustomed to it - as we probably have got used to distortions on my old CRT TV - but I'm reluctant to spend big on an LCD TV when one very important aspect of picture quality (for us) is significantly worse than an old CRT TV.
Please, please, please recommend me an LCD TV (32 to 37", up to £1k) that you feel doesn't suffer motion blur and I will endevour to view it.
A
Alarm
Plasma will have none what so ever. (ms reaction times)
Other screen will have slight 5ms reaction times being the better.
Other screen will have slight 5ms reaction times being the better.
C
ChrisFrost
I have a Planar 37" LCD at home which is exceptional. Sadly the brand is no longer available in the UK. It went the way of Fujitsu and Pioneer. To be fair it is a specialist product for video enthusiasts rather than mass market consumers. It seems that the UK is only interested in TVs that are either cheap or overloaded with bling and toys.
Thanks for your replies.
With regard to LCD panel reaction times, I can’t say that, subjectively, I’ve noticed a strong link between blurred motion and panel reaction times. That said, I guess all TV panels have reasonably fast reaction times these days so I’m wondering if the blurred motion effect I see is caused by something else. Academic really, because whatever the reason, I won’t buy a panel that exhibits motion blur – I may eat those words if my CRT TV packs up though!
Plasma panels are out of the equation because I don’t wish to add any more heaters to my living room.
Hadn’t heard of Planar LCD TVs. Searched the Internet and it sounds very promising. Shame it’s discontinued.
I agree about the UK marketplace and cheap/gimmicky TV’s. And it’s not just an issue with TV’s and home entertainment products either; it affects many other big-ticket items such as the domestic gas boiler I’m looking to buy. Makes you wonder if the UK market is flooded with poor quality products because we demand low prices or manufacturers are forcing them on us so we don’t have much choice but to buy?
With regard to LCD panel reaction times, I can’t say that, subjectively, I’ve noticed a strong link between blurred motion and panel reaction times. That said, I guess all TV panels have reasonably fast reaction times these days so I’m wondering if the blurred motion effect I see is caused by something else. Academic really, because whatever the reason, I won’t buy a panel that exhibits motion blur – I may eat those words if my CRT TV packs up though!
Plasma panels are out of the equation because I don’t wish to add any more heaters to my living room.
Hadn’t heard of Planar LCD TVs. Searched the Internet and it sounds very promising. Shame it’s discontinued.
I agree about the UK marketplace and cheap/gimmicky TV’s. And it’s not just an issue with TV’s and home entertainment products either; it affects many other big-ticket items such as the domestic gas boiler I’m looking to buy. Makes you wonder if the UK market is flooded with poor quality products because we demand low prices or manufacturers are forcing them on us so we don’t have much choice but to buy?
I have no motion blur on my Panasonic LCD but I have seen plenty of TVs with it. I can watch a fast moving action packed Hollywood blockbuster on Blu ray perfect. My sons LCD suffers with this but it was only a cheap Sharp so didn't expect to get the same level of picture. I read the reviews in What Hifi magazine and purchased the one they said was best. They say if the TV suffers from motion problems..
http://www.whathifi.com/reviews/tvs
http://www.whathifi.com/reviews/tvs
I watched Horse racing on my uncles philips 37" the other day and the Motion blur was terrible. But that was freeview and I only have SKY. I remember thinking to my self what an awful picture he had compared to mine and as he is partially blind I wondered if he would see a benifit watching it on mine....
Anyway here are some nice tvs the 2011 award winners http://www.whathifi.com/awards/2011/televisions
Anyway here are some nice tvs the 2011 award winners http://www.whathifi.com/awards/2011/televisions
I have a Planar 37" LCD at home which is exceptional. Sadly the brand is no longer available in the UK. It went the way of Fujitsu and Pioneer. To be fair it is a specialist product for video enthusiasts rather than mass market consumers. It seems that the UK is only interested in TVs that are either cheap or overloaded with bling and toys.
See, all I want is a good quality panel which takes an HDMI input and displays it. It need do absolutely nothing else but display the image presented to it.
C
ChrisFrost
The Planar sets would have been perfect for that.
It's 6 of one, half a dozen of another.
This constant price erosion thing started with the Japanese following the teachings of W.Edwards Demming. His credo was sound - cut out waste, improve efficiency, reduce costs - but it has been taken to extremes where each year the technology advances yet prices fall. The absurd conclusion is that TV manufacturing is no longer a profitable business unless you're either the No#1 brand by volume, or you make crap that cheap and sells in huge volume.
The other reason is poor salesmanship from the retail industry. Each major brand has low, mid and higher quality products. But the retail industry is so price-lead now that all it can focus on is "a sale at any cost". The result is retailers shunning the better quality products in favour of something cheaper. They've stopped asking customers about their needs (a consultative sell) and instead just sell a feature such as LED or 3D.
The Government hasn't helped. Abolishing RRPs has backfired. Customers are getting worse products and worse service.
Finally customers are greedy. But that's only human nature. Given the choice between better quality service or lower price.... well, you all know the rest.
The whole industry needs a dose of common sense. Manufacturer's need to restrict access to their product ranges to the dealers who can do the best job in each field:
Make basic ranges for the big discounters, online retailers & supermarkets. That will actually work in their favour and the consumers too. Simple but better quality products at consistently low prices for people who buy as a commodity.
Make a clear demarcation between retailer types so a customer understands what to expect.
Segment the mid and higher quality products to more specialist retailers. Retrain the dealers in the art of the consultative sell.
And most importantly, listen to customer feedback. How many times do we see threads like this where people are unhappy with the picture quality of their new TV. Does the price ever get mentioned? No, the price is forgotten.... It's the disappointment of poor quality that lingers in the memory.
Apologies to all. Rant over
No need for apologies. I couldn't agree more. And your English is excellent - only one spelling mistake in the entire rant!
I had to wine and dine a German visitor some years ago - a businessman. He summed up the "british problem" in two sentences:
"Ze trouble is zat in Germany ve go into ze shop und ve ask 'how reliable is zis television?' But you Eengleesh ask 'how much is zis television?' "
(Price-led.)
I had to wine and dine a German visitor some years ago - a businessman. He summed up the "british problem" in two sentences:
"Ze trouble is zat in Germany ve go into ze shop und ve ask 'how reliable is zis television?' But you Eengleesh ask 'how much is zis television?' "
(Price-led.)
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