Notifiction of area violation ?

[coalpit]

Guys I'm hoping that someone here can again help me out. I've got CCTV all set up and other systems too, but I would like to find some method of knowing if anyone has violated a particular exterior security area.

What I had in mind was taking a feed from a PIR that would have been triggered to a device that would provide a visual indication and the time of the incident. This would then make it easy (I hope) to wind back the CCTV recorder to see what/who caused the violation. The unit would be installed inside the building.

Many thanks

Richard

 

[OwainDIYer]

An ordinary intruder alarm panel with event logging.

Or wire the PIR directly to the CCTV recorder's external alarm inputs and use its event logs.

 

[seasickstevie]

This is something I've often thought about, and would be useful in many situations. Depends on how often you're likely to want to know about an event. In reality it can prove inconvenient if you need to keep going into a menu either on the CCTV system of into the alarm panel log.
The inconvenience means after a while you just don't bother about it.

I think the solution is an external mains PIR feeding a relay that will open an alarm circuit on your panel.
Use an alarm output (either latched or feeding a latched relay) to bring on an indicator light / strobe / buzzer to alert you.

Then of course you need to firstly view the alarm log. Then go to the appropriate time on your CCTV.

Saves having to check the log every time you've been out which just isn't 'possible'.

 

[sparkymarka]

Would have been better fitting a gjd lighting system in the first place, with a opal elite connected to the dvr alarm input, most people go for the cheapest option ( standalone pir/flood) and then find to add other things it ends up costing more and be more complicated !

 

[coalpit]

This is something I've often thought about, and would be useful in many situations. Depends on how often you're likely to want to know about an event. In reality it can prove inconvenient if you need to keep going into a menu either on the CCTV system of into the alarm panel log.
The inconvenience means after a while you just don't bother about it.

SNIP

Thanks for the suggestions. Yes you are right in that it has to be easy. The present set-up to trigger the Voice Off unit uses a mains PIR which triggers a relay that then starts the message running so the spare sets of contacts could be used to make or break another circuit.

What I'm hoping to do is have a visual indication that there has been an activation of the PIR and the time. There must be a simple way of accomplishing this but at the moment it's eluding me<G>

Cheers

Richard

PS the Voice Off is fantastic. I've set it so that it triggers when anyone gets to the edge of the protected zone, then if they actually get to the area very close to the glass doors I'm protecting the QH light comes on and with it a loud fire bell. If they are brazen enough to bang the doors or glass the external and internal Master Blasters connected to the alarm system go off!

 

[coalpit]

Would have been better fitting a gjd lighting system in the first place, with a opal elite connected to the dvr alarm input, most people go for the cheapest option ( standalone pir/flood) and then find to add other things it ends up costing more and be more complicated !

Thanks for your input. I've just got off the phone to gjd.co.uk to discuss this whole issue and they are not able to offer the solution I'm looking for which is to (a) have a visual indication that there has been an intrusion into the designated area and (b) at what time. If I have this information I can then very quickly see what/who has caused it by playing back the recorder. The CCTV cameras are set up so that each one records when something changes in a specific part of the area so I need to be able to pin down a time.

Now I'm just thinking aloud.... I've got a four wire security cable that runs from the security box to the wall adjacent to the security light/bell and the Voice Off. Can I use this with a pir to record the time event on the security log and not have the alarm system activate? Apologies if this all sounds bread and butter stuff but security systems are not my field<G>

Cheers

Richard


Cheers

Richard

 

[coalpit]

More thinking aloud! I have a computer running in the office 24/7 so surely this could be used to provide me with a time/event log of intrusion into specific areas. I'm sure one of the gurus here can help me with this<G>

Cheers

Richard

 

[bernardgreen]

Feeding the CCTV into a video delay line of say 20 seconds and feeding the output of the delay into a video recorder. When instrusion is detected the recorder is started and the 20 seconds of video before the instrusion is recorded as it leaves the delay line.

 

[seasickstevie]

Depends what alarm panel you've got. If it has the ability to set different 'wards' you may be able to program the zone in question to trigger an output specific to the indication purpose without bothering the rest of the system.
In reality you're probably best using a 'time-stamp' alarm panel just to do this job and nothing else, and not complicate your existing alarm system.

 

[seasickstevie]

I must say, it's surprising GJD haven't come up with a solution for this by now.
Perhaps I should put it to the Dragons

 

[coalpit]

Feeding the CCTV into a video delay line of say 20 seconds and feeding the output of the delay into a video recorder. When intrusion is detected the recorder is started and the 20 seconds of video before the instrusion is recorded as it leaves the delay line.

Thanks Bernard. This still means that I have to trawl through video footage just to see if there was an intrusion into the protected zone, or have I completely misunderstood what you are suggesting?

Just to recap, all my cameras are programmed to only record if there is a change of scene in the targeted area, and then the recorder records a few seconds each side as I understand it. This of course means that it records when a bat passes by, the wind blows the grass, etc.

What ideally I want is as soon as I get in the door of the premises I can see or hear a warning that there has been an entry into the protected zone with a time or times. I can then go straight to the time on the video recorder. Can I use the computer which runs 24/7 to do what I want do you think?

Cheers

Richard

 

[bernardgreen]

No because the only video on the recorder will be the 20 seconds before the instrusion and some minutes after the instrusion.

The length of recording after the event can be set on the recorder.

I would use break beam sensors for detecting intrusions rather than motion detection on cameras. Motion detection with cameras does work but as you found it can be triggered by many non instrusive events. Also it can fail to detect slow moving intruding objects / people.

 

[coalpit]

Depends what alarm panel you've got. If it has the ability to set different 'wards' you may be able to program the zone in question to trigger an output specific to the indication purpose without bothering the rest of the system.
In reality you're probably best using a 'time-stamp' alarm panel just to do this job and nothing else, and not complicate your existing alarm system.

Thanks, sounds interesting but can you expand on this concept of a time stamp alarm panel please. BTW my present alarm panel is a Scantronics 9651.

Cheers

Richard

 

[sparkymarka]

Do you have a dvr ? Yes/ no if so there is a alarm list on most dvrs so you connect the pir trigger to the the dvr and you look at the alarm list . Not rocket science ? Some dvrs have the ability to email events . I had a job where the security guards had to fob a reader fetching up an alarm on the dvr, the customer just looked at the events list to check that they had been ceiling the site.

 

[seasickstevie]

Yes DVRs have a log of all events. But who wants to spend their life reading logs all the time?

On my DVR I have to go through several 'sub-menus' to just get to the log.
Meanwhile the picture's not on the screen because I'm looking at a bloody log! . . . So I don't know what I'm missing.

I think what the op needs is as bernard says, a 'break-beam' that's not going to be suffering false alarms every few seconds on a windy day - which is hat can happen with a PIR. Connected to a latched feed to an indicator, so as when your back is turned for a few moments, you look back and if the indicator is on, you know it's worth pursuing.

An alarm panel that gives an easy to access log that's time and date 'stamped' (meaning the info stays there and doesn't disappear for some reason) linked to your beam.