Oil not coming from the suntec pump. HELP

[coleaine]

Hi al.
I have a Trianco Boiler its not getting oil from the pump,I have checked the line to the pump and its fine.
Its a Suntec pump and coil,I dont hear the coil click when I start the boiler from the reset button.
How can I check if its the coil or the pump,how do I check the power from the coil with a multi metre,and what should it read,there are three prongs on the cable to the coil in a triangle shape,which do I check for voltage.
What should it read and when should I get a reading .
Plus is it difficult to remove the pump and check for faults,I see 2 cap screws (alen key heads) holding it to the motor,is there anything I should watch out for falling out if I remove it,and is it difficult to refit.

Plus could anyone tell me where I can get a spare solenoid coil and pump if needed (quick delivery to N.I),I am not sure of the model number yet but It says Suntec on the pump and coil,and is there any other branded coil and pump that would fit this.

I need this working again,I am not working at the moment and have the time to work at it.

I am told also it could be a photocell problem,where do I get one of these.??

Please help,

 

[Burnerman]

The Suntec AS solenoids are 250v...you'll get what you need from heating-parts.co.uk
Splendid firm!
John

 

[coleaine]

The Suntec AS solenoids are 250v...you'll get what you need from heating-parts.co.uk
Splendid firm!
John

when i attach the metre to the coil socket the voltage goes up and down its not a content reading.

I can not find a solenoid coil at www.heating-parts.co.uk.

Ps. I REMOVED the pump to check and all looks ok the coupling is like new,and it turns freely.Do you think its a faulty coil,or controller?

Thanks for your reply.
Its very cold without the heat at the moment.

 

[Burnerman]

I certainly don't want to sound patronising here, but check again that all the tank valves are on, and that the burner motor is actually spinning. If both are ok here, the most common and obvious fault is the solenoid on top of the pump (heating-parts number 281915 - but there could be others)! However, check the photocell too for a low resistance in light to a very high resistance in darkness. I can't comment on a variable voltage to the coil.....some do (Riello) and some don't (Danfoss).
Heating-parts have a good help line - it could be worth a call for bits. 01278 455391.
Wishing you luck! John

 

[coleaine]

I certainly don't want to sound patronising here, but check again that all the tank valves are on, and that the burner motor is actually spinning. If both are ok here, the most common and obvious fault is the solenoid on top of the pump (heating-parts number 281915 - but there could be others)! However, check the photocell too for a low resistance in light to a very high resistance in darkness. I can't comment on a variable voltage to the coil.....some do (Riello) and some don't (Danfoss).
Heating-parts have a good help line - it could be worth a call for bits. 01278 455391.
Wishing you luck! John

Hi John,I fitted a new coil and still no luck,I opened the pressure screw a little and oil is coming into the pump,I am lost now ,could it be the Satronic TF830/B control box,or the photo cell.Is there anyway for me to check.?
How do i check the resistane of the photocell,what do i set the multi metre to,I am not sure how to use it.

Please reply ASAP..

 

[Burnerman]

Hi Coleaine
To use your multimeter to check for photocell resistance, set it to Ohms (upside down horse shoe symbol). In the light, the resistance will be low, but in total darkness the resistance will be very high - well into the Kohms range. However, we still aren't there yet....the solenoid on the pump operates an internal valve - this may be sticking. However, its also possible that the controller is faulty.....all a bit of guesswork here!
I'm a bit perplexed about your voltage reading to the solenoid...I wouldn't expect it to vary but it wouldn't necessarily have to be mains voltage. Is your meter set to read AC?
Inside the control box there is often a schematic diagram of what it does....for example, purge 10 sec, ignition starts, oil on, ignition stops etc..but it can be a fairly awkward thing to test, needing lots of patience!
Be lucky! John

 

[WDIK]

have you got oil at the pump?
have you checked performance with a pressure guage?

 

[coleaine]

have you got oil at the pump?
have you checked performance with a pressure guage?

Yes oil at the pump and pressure is good when I loosen the pressure screw.
Should the Solenoid coil not magnetize ,I removed it from the shaft and held a screwdriver inside it did not.I checked the Kohms on the coil connection and reads approx .100 when dark and .002 when shown to the light.

 

[coleaine]

Hi Coleaine
To use your multimeter to check for photocell resistance, set it to Ohms (upside down horse shoe symbol). In the light, the resistance will be low, but in total darkness the resistance will be very high - well into the Kohms range. However, we still aren't there yet....the solenoid on the pump operates an internal valve - this may be sticking. However, its also possible that the controller is faulty.....all a bit of guesswork here!
I'm a bit perplexed about your voltage reading to the solenoid...I wouldn't expect it to vary but it wouldn't necessarily have to be mains voltage. Is your meter set to read AC?
Inside the control box there is often a schematic diagram of what it does....for example, purge 10 sec, ignition starts, oil on, ignition stops etc..but it can be a fairly awkward thing to test, needing lots of patience!
Be lucky! John

hi again John.
Should the Solenoid coil not magnetize ,I removed it from the shaft and held a screwdriver inside it did not.I checked the Kohms on the coil connection and reads approx .100 when dark and .002 when shown to the light.

 

[WDIK]

yes if you have power the thing should open, the photo cell is for flame proving, next stage, if the solenoid doesnt open you dont get ignition so no flame, this is an ignition problem not a flame detection problem as you have no flame.

 

[Burnerman]

OK lets not get carried away....! There is oil to the primary side of the pump. You are getting a voltage to the pump solenoid, and the pump itself is spinning. Are you sure about all these?
So, the coil is energising, but still nothing happens...therefore it points to the valve inside the pump itself.....the body of which is non ferrous, but the moving parts are, therefore is not affected by the magnetism that the coil induces. As WDIK says, the photocell allows oil to continue flowing once a flame is established and seen.
I'm checking a photocell out now...its a Landis. 2.9Kohms when lit by a desk lamp, 200+K when dark, so the difference is huge. Hope this helps - but do the basic checks again as I think these pumps are about £90, and I don't know if the valves come separately. John

 

[coleaine]

OK lets not get carried away....! There is oil to the primary side of the pump. You are getting a voltage to the pump solenoid, and the pump itself is spinning. Are you sure about all these?
So, the coil is energising, but still nothing happens...therefore it points to the valve inside the pump itself.....the body of which is non ferrous, but the moving parts are, therefore is not affected by the magnetism that the coil induces. As WDIK says, the photocell allows oil to continue flowing once a flame is established and seen.
I'm checking a photocell out now...its a Landis. 2.9Kohms when lit by a desk lamp, 200+K when dark, so the difference is huge. Hope this helps - but do the basic checks again as I think these pumps are about £90, and I don't know if the valves come separately. John

I am not sure then about the coil,I thought it would magnetize when switching.there is oil at the primer side of pump ok,and pump Is turning,well the fan is turning.

 

[Burnerman]

I cant picture this particular burner, but on some, the motor is on the end, naturally, followed by the fan and then some type of flexible coupling that connects to the pump......these couplings involve fine plastic splines often enough and they fail frequently, and usually noisily - so its worth checking that out.
I've never tested a coil for magnetic induction....prefering to look for a voltage to it, and a resistance across it if I'm looking for a fault.
John

 

[coleaine]

I cant picture this particular burner, but on some, the motor is on the end, naturally, followed by the fan and then some type of flexible coupling that connects to the pump......these couplings involve fine plastic splines often enough and they fail frequently, and usually noisily - so its worth checking that out.
I've never tested a coil for magnetic induction....prefering to look for a voltage to it, and a resistance across it if I'm looking for a fault.
John

Hi again jOHN.
This unit has the fan to the lefhand side then the motor in the middle and the pump next.(FAN.MOTOR.PUMP.
i took the pump out and the Plastic coupling is like new ,and the pump turns freely.Unless the solenoid valve has stuck closed.The pump would not go back into position unless the coupling was lined up,so that part is fine.
Can I test the coil for resistance inside to centre hole where it fits over the brass shaft

Cheers John for all your help,It looks like another cold night again.

If you can think of anything else let me know.I wil be back at it again tomorow.

 

[Burnerman]

The valves on Riello and Danfoss pumps can be unscrewed from the pump body and I guess yours will be the same....
You have fitted a new coil, so you can test for resistance across it to see if there's a continuous circuit.
Under the pump end cover you'll find a gauze filter - if you haven't found it already! The sealing of same is usually courtesy of an 'o' ring.
Keep watching the thread - I'm sure someone else will throw their pennorth in. Chances are they'll be a lot more experienced than me anyway! Best wishes and keep warm John