P.A.T Testing

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hello there,
i have recently done my city and guilds 2377-200 inspection and testing of Electrical Equipment.i am just about to start my first P.A.T. Testing round at company and am trying to think of any problems i might have so i can solve them now before i start.i was wondering if any of you brain boxes could help me with a couple.

-3 phase 400v red plug.Is there a way to combined inspect them.
-Single phase 230v blue.Im presuming this is just a socket adaptor wired to a normal 3 pin plug.
-Fixed wiring installations-whilst reading the Code of practice for inservice inspection and testing of electrical equipment, i came across a very vauge section on fixed installations.It doesnt address how to P.A.T. test them.It just says should be tested on completion of installation and perodically in accordance with frequency of inspection.I didnt install these fixed installations does that mean i dont test them?ANd if i do test them what am i testing for?

Any help would be much appreciated

Thanks Guys

THEBIGBADPAD
 
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Not an expert - but until one comes along -
-3 phase 400v red plug.Is there a way to combined inspect them.
-Single phase 230v blue.Im presuming this is just a socket adaptor wired to a normal 3 pin plug.
Yes you can get adaptors.
http://www.seaward.co.uk/pat-e-news-issue3[quote]
-Fixed wiring installations-whilst reading the Code of practice for inservice inspection and testing of electrical equipment, i came across a very vauge section on fixed installations.It doesnt address how to P.A.T. test them.It just says should be tested on completion of installation and perodically in accordance with frequency of inspection.I didnt install these fixed installations does that mean i dont test them?[/QUOTE]No you do not.

Portable appliance test
 
We have to remember inservice inspection and testing of electrical equipment covers all but a portable appliance is as the name suggests and will weigh less than 18kg in weight or fitted with wheels and not fixed.

However I serviced a batching plant which arrived on site as around 5 wagon loads and was then assembled for lenght of job before being dismantled and moved to next.

So in real terms you are likely to be required to test all items with 13A plug which don't have a timer or temperature device which would stop you testing the whole device with your machine. Even if not truly portable as testing with machine is far faster than using other methods.

This of course will leave a selection of devices which you can't test. These must still be inspected and tested and there are a number of options to cover these items. The main one is a maintenance contract and with for example a washing machine which has timers so can't be tested with the machine the normal electrician would not have detailed knowledge required to test it so one takes out a maintenance contract.

With other items for example a hand drier one needs to remove it from the FCU in order to test but there is no real problem testing so any electrician could test these. But likely longer than 1 year between tests.

Three phase items may be testable with adaptors but it would need an electrician to work out if it can or can't be tested. With my old firm all items were first tested by an electrician who would decide on the test method our Robin machine would allow us to enter a code which would then set out the tests to be completed.

But most testers are single phase 3kW maximum so unless an electrician has worked out a quick test method I would just say sorry can't test these.

I think personally to have a semi-skilled guy to do the bulk of the items and to keep records makes a lot of sense. But any odd items which are not standard he must be able to back heal. An item like a freezer if switch off when you start doing testing will likely have warmed up enough for the motor to run when you get around to it so can be tested OK even though really it's not a portable appliance. But a frost free freezer is something else and only by doing some dismantling can it be tested or using a special diagnosis machine so these can't be PAT tested as there is no way to activate the de-frost element to test it.

Duel items are also a problem. Be that a lead set and item or something like a mag mount drill where the mag mount may be class I but the drill is class II one has to be careful that items are matched.
 
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Portable appliance test

You mean In-service Inspection and Testing of Electrical Equipment. "Portable Appliance Testing" is simply a commonly-used term. The Code of Practice does NOT simply include portables, and does indeed include items wired into a fused connection unit.
 
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See thread heading

You mean In-service Inspection and Testing of Electrical Equipment. "Portable Appliance Testing" is simply a commonly-used term. The Code of Practice does NOT simply include portables, and does indeed include items wired into a fused connection unit.
OK
 
Portable appliance test

You mean In-service Inspection and Testing of Electrical Equipment. "Portable Appliance Testing" is simply a commonly-used term. The Code of Practice does NOT simply include portables, and does indeed include items wired into a fused connection unit.
I can see your point but I also see no reason why a semi-skilled guy should not do the boring stuff leaving the more technical stuff for the skilled guy.

It is down to the manager to decide how to ensure all items are tested not the tester. It is the manager who keeps the equipment register up to date. So although the manager likely needs to be an electrician there is nothing to stop a semi-skilled guy from doing the simple stuff.

What I see as a problem is that some one who does a 2377-200 can think they are skilled and with C&G giving the 2377, 2381, and 2391 all the same rating of level 3 which is the highest one can go with further education it does suggest that a guy with a 2377 has the same level of skill as one with a 2391. OK anyone who has done both knows there is a world of difference but some one who has only done a 2377 does not know how simplistic the course is as he has nothing to compare it with. He very likely considers himself as skilled.

Numbers seem to have changed from when I did it years ago so maybe there is some change but when I did it there were two exams one for testing the other for management.

When doing my course I was under the impression that all I had to test was items less than 18kg and not fixed. It was only years latter when I was the Electrical Engineer that I realised how I was all those years ago only doing a fraction of what I should have done. It does not matter if it's a hard wired hand drier or a complete batching plant with concrete press it still needs testing by some one. Although the word used is often maintained rather than tested it amounts to the same.

To be frank I see again and again where neither the testing or record keeping is up to scratch often electricians feel if it runs and is safe there is no need to waist time filling in a book or other record to show what they have done. Only when things go wrong and the HSE are on site asking to view these records do the guys realise their error.

The rules are simple anything to do with health and safety must be written down. An email is good enough it does not need to be on paper. So if I walk past an oil spillage and tell my foreman but do not fill in a report and some one slips on the oil and is injured. And after that the HSE arrives and I with a big mouth go and tell him I had reported this to my foreman and admit I did not fill in a report form then I could end up in court for not reporting it in writing. This is basic health and safety training. Of course anyone with any sense does not admit they were aware so they can't be taken to court.

We as electricians can use this to our advantage. In one job the workshop was designated as a quarantine area and all items were signed in and out. To remove an item without it being signed out was considered as gross industrial misconduct and as such of course anyone caught removing items could be dismissed. It never went that far but it could.

OK we have all done our 2377 and we all have been taught about how we must keep an equipment register form V1.1, Repair register form V1.4, and Faulty equipment register form V1.5 and we all know for any item to return back to service after it has been logged in the Faulty equipment register there must be an entry in the Repair register to show it has been repaired. We also know often items are sent for repair and when they arrive back they go straight into service and paperwork goes to accounts and to get it from accounts to show it was repaired is really hard if not impossible yet we and I include myself often just don't get around to doing the paperwork.

I was on one job where they thought they could out source all PAT testing until we pointed out if they did every time something was repaired the firm would need to retest it. So we were allowed to inspect and test but still there was no paperwork between both firms so one had to check both firms records.

I would guess very few firms follow the rules to the letter. And at some time I am sure we have all made mistakes both with testing and with record keeping. But fortunately it is very rare for the HSE to take an interest so we normally get away with it.
 
Thanks very much guys for your advice and help. Especially ericmark. Found what you said very interesting and im sure it will help me overcome a few problems i am likely to come across.
Just proves Experiance is everything.
:D
 

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