part P courses - what can full qualified electricians do

[beezo]

Hi guys,

Im looking into doing a part P course. Im a qualfied gas installer and regulary rely on an elctrician to put fuse spurs in for me

anyway, I know its not ideal but i need quite a quick turn around on this as im self employed so the quicker I do it, the quicker i can save money.

I will be looking at doing a part time college course to do the full works but until such time, this will have to do

what I want to know is what can fully qualified electricians do that part p installers cant?? also, whats the differance between the part p defind scope and full scope

thanks in advance

 

[EFLImpudence]

what I want to know is what can fully qualified electricians do that part p installers cant??

It's not a question of qualifications (sore point to many).
It's whether you are registered with a competent person scheme and can self-certify
(fees and annual assessment and cheap notification)

or pay the LABC for notifiable work before you start each job.
(two or three of which will equal the annual scheme fee)

Of course, either way you will need insurance and relevant testing equipment.

Google Elecsa, Napit or NICEIC.

also, whats the differance between the part p defind scope and full scope

Will have to wait for someone else. I am not sure what the limitations of defined scope are.

 

[riveralt]

whats the differance between the part p defind scope and full scope

Defined scheme limits you to electrical work which forms part of your normal work - as defined by Napit

Defined Scope – installation of fixed low or extra-low
voltage electrical installations as a necessary adjunct
to or arising out of other work being carried out by the
registered person

Qualifications you will need:
1. Basic electrical competence
This qualification must include the elements of testing and inspection relevant to defined scope work.
Acceptable certificates include the EAL Domestic Installers Qualification or a Certificate of Competence ISO 17024 covering defined scope electrical work.

2. Understanding of BS7671
A certificate covering understanding of the current edition BS7671 must be obtained within 12 months of a successful on-site assessment. Acceptable certificates include C&G 2382 or equivalent.

 

[Taylortwocities]

So, you could then install a spur, or extend a ring final to provide power to the new boiler that you are providing.

You would not be permitted to provide a circuit out to the garden shed, as that is not a necessary adjunct to or arising out of other work being carried out

There is a huge hole in all of this wording:
Let's suppose that wiring for the new fused spur is to be buried in the wall less than 50mm deep. The regs say this circuit would require RCD protection. Would the defined scope person then be permitted to change the consumer unit to provide the RCD protection for the circuit?

 

[viewer]

Over six years ago I attended a "Part P course", not for trade, but to be sure that the small jobs around my house could be done safely by myself. It was made quite clear that the course was for installers - people already working as kitchen fitters, boiler installers etc. who before the advent of Part P would have done this work anyway without any training. It was never intended to be a substitute for any existing electrical training. British Gas sent their people on the course so that they could do exactly the type of job the OP describes. Councils sent their people on the course so that they could talk to electricians. A crucial part of this course is to know what you know and stay within that framework. Despite all the arguments on this forum, the law and the supporting structures are clear enough to provide pragmatic answers to a conscientious person even if the legislation and guidance is poorly written. So, for TTC's question, the tradesman would put a RCBO into the CU (and test) or leave it to an electrician. There isn't really a conflict and a plumber would probably not find it cost effective to spend time on electrical work which was not simple and straightforward.
I'd suggest that the first step would be to compare the cost of the course, the extra insurance and the lost work hours for the course with the amount spent on employing an electrician over a reasonable period - say three years.

 

[bernardgreen]

From personal experience of sorting out a friend's "electrical problems" I can with some degree of certainty say that the so called Part P courses are pretty useless. The builder with newly aquired so called "Part P qualification" made a complete mess of the new electrical work in the kitchen. This was due to lack of experience in electrical work. Before his "Part P wallification" he had employed an electrician. The course for the qualification taught him very little other than how to register his work with the local authority in a way that they would accept.

How many very good and reliable builders go on courses for Parts A to M and then describe themselves as being Part A Qualified , Part B qualified and so on through the alphabet. Yet these parts of the building process are accepted by local authorities on the signature of the builder and architect if involved.

Dodgy electrics can be dangerous, but dodgy walls, floors and roof structures covered by the other parts are far more dangerous.

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

Hi guys,

Im looking into doing a part P course

Have you chosen a course and do you know what it entails, what qualification you come out with and whether this qualification allows you to install and register as define scope ?
I would first do a search of the all scheme providers and then contact them
A list here
competent person
See what requirements and qualifications they are after from you to become a member, that will then tell you your best route to progress to being registered with one.

Part P is a building regulation, you need to be aware of it and the methods needed to comply to it, you do not need a qualification in it!

 

[ban-all-sheds]

By a "Part P course" most people mean something like the EAL Domestic Installer course.

Cheapest way to do that is at your local college. You also get the benefit of it being 1 evening a week rather than a 5-day sheep-dip, but quite honestly if you aren't already completely competent to do whatever work you want to do having gained the qualification the course will not help.

 

[neallew]

The "part P" City and Guilds certified course is just how to conform to the regs and how to notify jobs - either be in a competent person scheme or how to inform building control to inspect the job. So I cant see how the OP will get any benefit unless suitably qualified and trained to do the work and join an installers scheme.

So to install a new spur you would need the qualifications and training to alter the circuits safely and join an installers scheme for defined scope to get any benefit as just having part p means you still have to inform building control and get them to inspect it to issue a Minor Electrical Installation Works Certificate. If you dont have,17th edition, test and inspection and the gear to achieve it to issue the correct certification and join the installers scheme to be able to self notify jobs to building control to comply.