PIR (switches) in parallel?

[aesmith]

Hi,
This is for an area in one of our sheds where we have the controls for the electric fence, and various feed bins etc. It's approached across an unlit yard, and there's no lighting at present in the shed either. What I'd like to do is have the lights PIR controlled, but coming on when someone's approaching as well as remaining on while they're within the area. I don't think all that can be covered with one PIR, so I was wondering if they can be connected in parallel so the lights come on so long as either of them is triggered. Would that work? I'm hoping they use a relay to switch the load, or some other arrangement that won't care if the load side is already energised by another switch.

Thanks, Tony S

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Would wiring switches be feasible? You can do what you want, but PIRs are notoriously unreliable (I don't mean they break, but they don't work predictably)

 

[aesmith]

I want the light to come on as she approaches the shed across the yard, to save having to go around with a torch all the time, that was the reason for thinking PIR. I was hoping they were more reliable nowadays as I see many commercial buildings where the lights absolutely rely on them. (As an aside we worked on a building like that but where the sensor for the toilets initially didn't cover the cubicles, so you might have to crap in the dark unless someone else came in while you were engaged. Hopefully corrected before the building was handed over).

Back to the case in point, I could use PIR for the approach control supplemented by a switch within the building. However in that case I think they'd need to control separate lights, otherwise you wouldn't be sure the switch was off when leaving. I was hoping that covering the area of interest with two or more PIRs would help.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

And the reason you can't just have a switch that "she" can use to turn the lights on in the yard?

 

[333rocky333]

As long both supplys are from the same source then you can, a 3 core and earth link between the 2 switches would do the job

 

[aesmith]

And the reason you can't just have a switch that "she" can use to turn the lights on in the yard?

Problem is there's nowhere to put such as switch. Not sure how I can explain without a diagram. The buildings are detached from the house, with a single power feed to the workshop which is the nearest, and everything else is fed from that workshop. Heading from the house directly to the shed in question is around 50m, digging a trench for a duct would be a major job.

Although of course two way switching from the house and the shed would be ideal if it had been possible.

I wonder if wireless switches would be an option, not sure what their range is.

 

[rsgaz]

two way switching from the house and the shed would be ideal

Take a look at Quinetic wireless, you'd need one receiver and two switches...

https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_Index/Wiring_Accessories_Menu_Index/Quinetic/index.html

No need to run cables at all, not even for the switches.

edit: I linked to one item, instead of the whole range.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I expect the makers can tell you the range...

 

[JohnW2]

The TLC listing which was posted says "

• Range:
  Indoor: 30Mtrs
  Outdoor: 160Mtrs (approx)

 

[aesmith]

Take a look at Quinetic wireless ..

That stuff shows a lot of promise, the floodlights with built in receiver might have other uses as well. Just being tight but it's a shame it can't be two way switched with a local conventional switch.

 

[rsgaz]

it's a shame it can't be ... a local conventional switch.

It sort of can, by putting...

https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/QUGDMK.html

into a suitable frame (you need a yoke,also)...

https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_I...hite_All/Grid_System/Grid_System_1/index.html

 

[aesmith]

It sort of can, by putting...

By "sort of" do you mean using a local RF switch that looks like a conventional one?

Looking at another product (https://www.rfsolutions.co.uk/downloads/1456311486DS-SWITCHLINK.pdf) these seem to be a change over switch, so if I'm reading the data sheet correctly the N/O and N/C outputs could be combined with a conventional switch to give two-way between the remote and local switch. More expensive though.

 

[rsgaz]

By "sort of" do you mean using a local RF switch that looks like a conventional one?

Yes.

But what I was getting at, is that not everybody likes the way grid switches look. A bit too office-ish. They certainly look out of place if the other switches in the room aren't the same. But, that's the nearest you'll get to 'normal' looking switches with that range.

 

[flameport]

but it's a shame it can't be two way switched with a local conventional switch.

This stuff can: https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_Index/Security_Menu_Index/EasySwitch/index.html
the receiver unit has a changeover relay, exactly like any 2 way switch https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/LMESR1.html
and for the radio switch(es) you can use any normal switch https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/LMEST1.html
or the keyfob style things, or the PIRs, or any combination of up to 16 of them.

 

[securespark]

IME, Steinel are very good and as with all PIR's they are more sensitive to movement across their beams than movement towards them.