Planning Permission Fees

[Eddman]

I am trying to find out whether an application would be needed to convert a loft space of a 3 bed small HMO (classC4), into a new bedroom and re-arrange internally to create a further new bedroom - thus becoming a 5 bed small HMO (class C4). if this were a dwellinghouse i beleive the works would be permitted development. I asked the local planning authority and their 'technical support' staff (more like non-support!) said i need to submit a pre-app with a fee of £45!!!!

Other fees are freely available and i cannot find anything about this! Can anyone help me.....please

 

[wessex101]

I looked into this a while ago and got conflicting advice, Council saying HMO's didn't have permitted development but some planning consultants said they do. In the end the project didn't go ahead so I didn't pursue it. However, I recently found this that suggests they do have permitted development rights provided it meets the requirement of a dwelling house (seems to be no self contained units of accommodation like a flat). https://planningjungle.com/2014/02/...t-an-hmo-can-benefit-from-part-1-of-the-gpdo/

Hopefully some of the usual suspects will have first hand knowledge.

 

[oldbutnotdead]

And pre-planning 'advice' is not compulsory. You can apply for planning permission for anything you like (or a Certificate of Lawful Development). Pre-planning advice may assist you in submitting an application that will pass at first go but it is NOT a legal requirement.

 

[tony1851]

Small HMOs up to 6 persons have the same p.d. rights as C3 dwellings.

General point; LPAs by default will almost always say something needs planning permission, even if it doesn't. They rely on ignorance of lay persons to rake fees in.

 

[Nakajo]

tony, have you got anything to back that up - it's not something I've encountered personally but I understood it was a bit of a grey area as to whether they came under C3 or C4

 

[Nakajo]

I suppose the point is, you're not changing the Use Class, so there is no material change here (from a Planning perspective). You will however need building regs approval. And you may need Planning permission if providing an enlarged dormer within the loft space.

 

[Eddman]

thank you all for your replies. I am going to read the document linked by wessex 101 and come back...

i think i will be telling the client that if he wants a dormer - we need a planning application - will this be £172 as for extension to C3 or £385 for a full planning app?

if he doesn't want a dormer we don't need planning at all and will just submit the building regulations application.

Thanks again for the responses and any more input is always welcome!

Eddy

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

HMO's have the same PD rights as normal dwellings: http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/pins/advice_for_inspectors/hmo_2014.pdf

So unless the house is in an AONB or other anomaly then no PP is required, subject to it meeting the PD criteria. Even if it were it would be £172 as this would be a Householder Application.

 

[Eddman]

thanks again freddymercurystwin, if i wanted to construct a dormer on the front elevation - would the planning application be a householder app with £172 fee?

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

A dormer on the front would be a householder app with £172 fee? But chances of a front dormer is slim unless all the neighbours have one, even so the planners would still be awkward sods. They detest front dormers.

 

[Eddman]

that planning jungle website is an interesting one - anyone a paid up member? is it worth it?

i suppose that will depend on how many contentious application you undertake!

i like sticking it to 'the man' and love reading about appeals that overturn the planning officer decisions! - does that make me a bad person??

 

[Nakajo]

No, it's not really worth it - because everyone here's so knowledgeable

 

[tony1851]

Have to disagree there - it's £50/year and I've found it very useful. Many LPAs themselves are corporate members.

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

No, it's not really worth it - because everyone here's so knowledgeable

Aye in fairness to others, it's because they are members that they are so knowledgeable!