Poor outer walls

[cruentus]

I live in a council flat.

The outer walls consist of 2cm of sandy material that crumbles away the moment the thin layer of plaster is breached. Beyond that is a layer that seems to consist of many individual hard stones.

The consequence of this is that as soon as i drill into it, the drill bit hits the stone and can go no further. Every attempt at drilling is met with *dink*. I've tried cracking the stone before with a hammer and nail but just end up crumbling the outer layer away to create a big mess.

There are some places where it's possible to drill deep enough to get a wall plug in but the deeper I go the more likely I'll hit a stone and if it's not deep enough the plugs will just wiggle in the sand. Today I decided to try using metal self drill fixtures/anchors. I snapped one in the attempt.

I want to be able to put shelves up on my walls. Is there any way I can do this that I haven't thought of?

Thanks for your help.

Greg

 

[noseall]

God bless no fines!

The only thing i can think of is a floor to ceiling affair that is secured at the floor and ceiling (obviously) consisting of some uprights that the shelves can be fixed to.

Other than that borrow an s.d.s. drill and drill a decent sized hole in order to use chemical anchors.

is the drill you are using an s.d.s.?

 

[cruentus]

is the drill you are using an s.d.s.?

No; standard hammer drill. You think that will make that much of a difference? One time i broke off the wing of a masonary bits tip by trying to drill inbetween stones. They're pretty hard.

 

[Monkeh]

I've had some success by drilling pilots in stones with smaller bits (started off with a 4mm and worked my way up to 10mm.. that was a battery-murdering TV hanging).

 

[noseall]

No; standard hammer drill. You think that will make that much of a difference? One time i broke off the wing of a masonary bits tip by trying to drill inbetween stones. They're pretty hard.

Unfortunately it won't prevent drill tip breakage but it may improve actual drilling capacity.

The problem with no-fies concrete is the gaps between the stones and the fact that it snatches the drill bit, thus damaging the tips. This will occur with an s.d.s. but probably less so with an emphasis on the s.d.s. being able to punch its way through the stones as opposed to simply stopping.

 

[cruentus]

I've had some success by drilling pilots in stones with smaller bits (started off with a 4mm and worked my way up to 10mm.. that was a battery-murdering TV hanging).

I think i'll try that. Use a small non-masonary bit and see if i can put a hole in the stone.

I'm using one of these.

 

[noseall]

Beg or borrow an s.d.s. and see how you go, you may be surprised.

 

[Monkeh]

I've had some success by drilling pilots in stones with smaller bits (started off with a 4mm and worked my way up to 10mm.. that was a battery-murdering TV hanging).

I think i'll try that. Use a small non-masonary bit and see if i can put a hole in the stone.

I'm using one of these.

I used masonry bits. And a really cheap (£20 Focus own brand) 18V cordless. YMMV.

 

[cruentus]

I just managed to shatter a Titanium Nitride coated HSS bit into the wall so that didn't work.

Starting to accept that I just can't drill into my outer walls.

Can't see anyone I know having a s.d.s ..... would love to tryone.

 

[Monkeh]

I just managed to shatter a Titanium Nitride coated HSS bit into the wall so that didn't work.

HSS bits aren't really made for masonry work. And if you tried hammer, that really will do them in.

Can't see anyone I know having a s.d.s ..... would love to tryone.

Any tradesmen on your street? I borrow an SDS off the plumber over the road when needed..

 

[cruentus]

HSS bits aren't really made for masonry work. And if you tried hammer, that really will do them in.

Ahh yes the hammer part would be my mistake there actualy. I switched to the HSS for once i'd hit the hard stone and was trying to make a hole in it. Masonry bits just tend to skim all over them.

I did manage to get one wall plug in using the method but it was absolute mess. The brackets i'm using have 3 holes and I doubt I'd be able to get the holes accurate enough anyway. Even if two lined up there's no way three would and the bracket be parallel.

 

[Monkeh]

HSS bits aren't really made for masonry work. And if you tried hammer, that really will do them in.

Ahh yes the hammer part would be my mistake there actualy. I switched to the HSS for once i'd hit the hard stone and was trying to make a hole in it. Masonry bits just tend to skim all over them.

Start off in non-hammer and it shouldn't wander so much.

 

[cruentus]

Start off in non-hammer and it shouldn't wander so much.

So make an initial indent with non-hammer and then switch to break through?

I think I'm going to give up - the holes just aren't going to end up where I want them.

 

[Monkeh]

Start off in non-hammer and it shouldn't wander so much.

So make an initial indent with non-hammer and then switch to break through?

I think I'm going to give up - the holes just aren't going to end up where I want them.

That's what I did, worked well enough. But it really does depend on the stone. See if you can find someone who'll lend you an SDS (or rent one, cheap enough) and give that a shot.

 

[cruentus]

What are Chemical Anchors? Could I use them to fill quite a large hole and then screw into that?

Wondering if I could use a small chisel to just make as deep a hole as possible and then just fill it in.