Pressure washer fault, extension lead?

[paul243]

My Nilfisk E140.2 washer has started acting up. It runs for a few minutes but if I stop and try to start again it "buzzes" loudly and then blows the fuse in the plug. I'm advised it may be the capacitor or, more likely, I'm using the wrong extension lead.
So question is can I make a larger capacity lead with 2.5mm cable with a normal socket and plug?
All the leads 16 amp leads I see have "caravan" type plug and socket.
Machine is rated at 2100 Amps.
Thanks

 

[RandomGrinch]

Hi,

I may be wrong, but I may also suspect the capacitor.
An easy check, exclude the extension lead - plug it straight into a mains socket and see if it does the same?

...and depending on cable length, a 1.25mm cable should be more than adequate for a 13A extension lead. Something like this:
https://cpc.farnell.com/pro-elec/pel01009/extension-lead-1-gang-ip54-10m/dp/PL15879

I would guess that is 2100W rather than amps!
So using 10A, again a 1.25mm cable is fine!

 

[paul243]

Thanks yes Watts!
Is my domestic cable reel likely to be 1.5mm? I thought I needed larger2.5mm and 16 amp cable , not so?
Will try direct to mains socket and report back.

 

[RandomGrinch]

Is my domestic cable reel likely to be 1.5mm?

The maximum rating of the extension lead should be written on it and the size of the conductors are normally embossed onto the cable.
What length is your lead and do you always use it fully unwound?

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

My Nilfisk E140.2 washer has started acting up. It runs for a few minutes but if I stop and try to start again it "buzzes" loudly and then blows the fuse in the plug.

That would suggest to me, two possibilities - either the start capacitor is failing or the pump + motor is trying to start under load, the unload valve if their is one, is not doing its job.

 

[paul243]

The maximum rating of the extension lead should be written on it and the size of the conductors are normally embossed onto the cable.
What length is your lead and do you always use it fully unwound?

Cable from machine is 1.0mm printed on cable
Extension cable I can't see anything printed but both of the cables measure identical 7mm overall diameter Can't remove either plug to measure the core.
Extension is 20 metres+ and used unwound.
And thanks Harry

 

[plugwash]

I'm pretty sure permaplug 13A plugs and sockets will fit on 2.5mm² H07RN-F, though it's a bit of a squeeze, I certainly see suppliers selling leads of such construction, for example https://www.industrialextensionlead...y-13amp-25mm-cable-extension-lead-11186-p.asp

Motor-diven loads can have issues on long extension leads, because the startup current can be much higher than the normal operating current, this leads to more volt drop which means the motor starts slower and in extreme cases can even fail to start. Still I suspect they are also a conviniant place to point fingers when the issue really lies with the appliance.

 

[paul243]

I'm pretty sure permaplug 13A plugs and sockets will fit on 2.5mm² H07RN-F, though it's a bit of a squeeze, I certainly see suppliers selling leads of such construction, for example https://www.industrialextensionlead...y-13amp-25mm-cable-extension-lead-11186-p.asp

Motor-diven loads can have issues on long extension leads, because the startup current can be much higher than the normal operating current, this leads to more volt drop which means the motor starts slower and in extreme cases can even fail to start. Still I suspect they are also a conviniant place to point fingers when the issue really lies with the appliance.

Thanks, so do I need to go as big as 2.5mm?

 

[RandomGrinch]

Thanks, so do I need to go as big as 2.5mm?

Using one online voltage drop calculator, 1.25mm cable would drop about 6.5V over 20M - which would probably be ok; although that would also depend on the quality of the connection on the plugs and sockets.
Any additional resistance from corrosion would effect the result.

...and that does rather depend on your cable being 1.25mm to start with!
If it was 1.00mm, then it may be worth an upgrade anyway!

If you wanted to be sure, you could use 1.5mm cable. Voltage drop would be better and I know it fits into Permaplugs and sockets!

https://cpc.farnell.com/pro-elec/pelb0758/cable-3183y-1-50mm-orange-5m/dp/CB22769

....definitely worth checking in a mains socket first though!

 

[SUNRAY]

Personally I feel you are barking up the wrong tree.
I use my Karcher, which I believe is about 2KW, anually on 150m of 1.5mm² extention (3x 50m) in a venue where the voltage is invariably around 225V. My quick guestimate says that has to be less than 200V at the machine which I've never questioned its operation.
I know it's not the same machine and I have no idea if mine has any sort of pressure unloader valve (or for that matter the Nilfisk) but if either of the 2 situations should be a problem it should be mine.

Have you tried pulling the trigger before switching on the power?

EDIT: The socket I use is on a 16mm² submain of something around 130m supplying a couple of sewage pumps.

 

[paul243]

Using one online voltage drop calculator, 1.25mm cable would drop about 6.5V over 20M - which would probably be ok; although that would also depend on the quality of the connection on the plugs and sockets.
Any additional resistance from corrosion would effect the result.

...and that does rather depend on your cable being 1.25mm to start with!
If it was 1.00mm, then it may be worth an upgrade anyway!

If you wanted to be sure, you could use 1.5mm cable. Voltage drop would be better and I know it fits into Permaplugs and sockets!

https://cpc.farnell.com/pro-elec/pelb0758/cable-3183y-1-50mm-orange-5m/dp/CB22769

....definitely worth checking in a mains socket first though!

Thanks for input.
Update. Connected without extension.
Used for 10 minutes today, started fine. Stopped and when restarted , loud buzz and blown 13 amp fuse in plug.
Tried again with new fuse, loud buzz and blown fuse. Now non starter.
So Capacitor?

 

[SUNRAY]

Thanks for input.
Update. Connected without extension.
Used for 10 minutes today, started fine. Stopped and when restarted , loud buzz and blown 13 amp fuse in plug.
Tried again with new fuse, loud buzz and blown fuse. Now non starter.
So Capacitor?

Did you try pulling the trigger to release the pressure?

 

[paul243]

Did you try pulling the trigger to release the pressure?

Yes but wasn't quick enough! Just tried it again, ran it for a few minutes, stopped it. Re-start, loud buzz, blown fuse.
Seems my nearest agent is a 100 mile round trip so nearest skip I think.
Ps no reply from Nilfisk HQ!

 

[Sureitsoff?]

I would be tempted to try a new capacitor as they are not really that expensive. OK its a loss if it isnt that but...

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjN1Ore75P2AhWGTcAKHWqfCWkQFnoECAcQAQ&url=https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201156752945&usg=AOvVaw3WtWSlKyBle4rgp2r9EA91

and have a read of this as well
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...dels.521760/&usg=AOvVaw364qeUZ55tfQNSpqR2SeWU

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

So Capacitor?

Yes, capacitor.