Professional Re-Wire... How much mess?

[Ivor Windybottom]

We have elderly relatives who have a bungalow with 1960s rubber insulated cable with a fuse wire fusebox. I replaced a switch, I first thought it was new as the live was brown. Turned out it was red, but it had turned brown by rotting! It was crumbly and perished. The backboxes are wood. It's all dangerous, plus they're not capable of safely changing a fuse wire while standing on a step ladder to reach the fusebox in the dark.

I've suggested a complete rewire, I don't think there's a less disruptive alternative. After several years of my nagging and their denial, they're finally going to start asking for quotes. Now I'm worried I'm going to finish them off with stress when the work starts.

It's a typical 1960s bungalow. 3 bedrooms, living, kitchen/diner, dining room, single garage, hallway, porch, back hallway, one bathroom. It has a suspended wooden floor. Unconverted loft with ladder and full access to all ceilings. All solid wet-plastered onto block or possibly brick. They mostly want like-for-like replacement, but there will be some additional light switches, sockets and swapping singles for doubles. There are sodding ornaments, pictures and ornamental tat everywhere! Hopefully they are capable of packing this stuff away in advance.

Can someone please let me know what this is going to look like and how long it could take? They have all fitted carpets, with gripper strips around the edges. I'm actually wondering if it may make sense to send them away on holiday and we manage and clear up for them, I'm worried they may explode and either do themselves an injury or just annoy the poor electricians into leaving.

 

[blup]

A couple of weeks for one sparky on his own - that's how long mine took back in the day, which included complete rewire (old cables were all rubber insulated) and chasing in the ring main. He worked 8 hours a day, so probably allow three weeks for two men by todays standards.

 

[johnny2007]

Couple of weeks plus a couple of days for a decorator to patch things up.
Repaired walls will never be the same colour, as long as they don't mind, otherwise it will take a full week to redecorate the lot.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

A couple of weeks for one sparky on his own - that's how long mine took back in the day, which included complete rewire (old cables were all rubber insulated) and chasing in the ring main. He worked 8 hours a day, so probably allow three weeks for two men by todays standards.

Surface trunking, would be the quicker and much less messy way to do it, but probably will need some floorboards lifted. It could be done, designed to be later sunk into walls, on a room by room basis as they were redecorated.

An immediate quick safety fix, would be to add an RCD, to cover the entire supply.

 

[Ivor Windybottom]

Surface trunking, would be the quicker and much less messy way to do it, but probably will need some floorboards lifted. It could be done, designed to be later sunk into walls, on a room by room basis as they were redecorated.

An immediate quick safety fix, would be to add an RCD, to cover the entire supply.

Two very good ideas there. I'd do this in my own house and do the sinking in myself. But the redecoration would be by him, so he'd need to call the sparky back to do the sinking in so it could get expensive. But I'll definitely suggest that if it would ease their resistance. Although I suspect that it looking crap for a time may be a major factor against.

I'd thought about adding an RCD alone. But I doubt that any electrician would want the responsibility of connecting a new consumer unit to their undoubtedly dodgy cabling.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

I'd thought about adding an RCD alone. But I doubt that any electrician would want the responsibility of connecting a new consumer unit to their undoubtedly dodgy cabling.

No need, it would just need to be fitted in the tails, between meter and consumer unit, just as an emergency, temporary fix.

Most/many DNO's will connect an isolator for free, just buy and fix an isolator to the board, then just switch off, and then add the RCD yourself.

 

[ericmark]

I had to be mothers rewired, I used a large firm able to flood the house with tradesmen if required, and this was the case for the last day. All done in a week, but not made good, I did that latter.

Since she had dementure it was not possible to do it safely with mother as home, she had to go into a home while being done.

It was a bare bones rewire designed to allow me to rent out the house if required.

We did try fitting RCD's before the rewire, but it tripped and the electrician who fitted the new consumer unit before the rewire, came without the tools required to do the job.

One could test using a clamp on meter first to see if a RCD is likely to trip, and with all RCBO consumer units disruption should be minimal, but since now required, if fitted and they trip, unlike when mothers was found to be substandard, there is no real wriggle room for the RCD/RCBO to be removed again.

So needs to be tested first.

 

[flameport]

I'm actually wondering if it may make sense to send them away on holiday and we manage and clear up for them,

That is exactly the thing to do.
Will also be much quicker as no need to have power available at the end of each day, or to keep certain rooms available, or to stop work at certain times that suit others.

Bungalow with suspended floor is about as good as you will get - all lighting done via the loft, only switch drops in each room, and if very lucky some or all may already be in conduit that can be reused.
Cabling for sockets under the floor, and with some careful choices like having sockets in one room back onto those in the adjacent room, time spent removing carpets and floorboards can be minimised.

They have all fitted carpets, with gripper strips around the edges.

Those are easy enough to remove and put back provided you only lift a corner or one edge at a time.

 

[Ivor Windybottom]

I think they might want to be there while it's done. Also not sure if we can make the time to manage the entire job.

Would most electricians be able to work on one or two rooms at a time? Perhaps if they are told which rooms to clear when then it could work out OK.

We're just going to have to work on them about the decor. I'd like to get decorators in to do everything but I suspect his pride will get in the way of this plan. Besides, the plaster will need time to dry anyway. She'll want it all looking perfect within a month, he's at risk of killing himself off trying to keep her happy. Also he's a retired plasterer and actually thinks he can fill the chases himself - even though he's almost 80 and in very bad health, but also in denial about this.

I suppose the answer is probably two stages - empty each room, re-wire, plaster, move back in with bare wet plaster. The repainting can be done much more gradually a room at a time. But I suspect there will be much more urgency in their minds.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Would most electricians be able to work on one or two rooms at a time? Perhaps if they are told which rooms to clear when then it could work out OK.

That would add dramatically to the cost, best option would be floor by floor, upstairs first, living down, then downstairs mostly living up.

 

[Adam_151]

I think they might want to be there while it's done. Also not sure if we can make the time to manage the entire job.

Thing is, thats likely to make it take more time and therefore cost more, the fact that they are retired is likely to also make it worse, its bad enough when the occupant works but needs to return each night, because floor boards have to be down and lighting and power have to be opperational, but retired folk there all the time, then extra care is going to have to be taken to make sure stuff isn't left in the way, and presume they are going to want to use toilet and kitchen facilities throughout the day, if you have to break off from chopping in sockets in the kitchen and have a tidy up, so that they can get in and make lunch, before resuming in the afternoon, then thats obviously going to add time to the job

Would most electricians be able to work on one or two rooms at a time? Perhaps if they are told which rooms to clear when then it could work out OK.

That would likely make it very difficult, if you take for example the lighting, the switches are likely to be in the same, or very similar places to the existing (which will be in the way). On on occupied rewire, you might one day do all the lighting, kill the old, take down all the fittings, rip off all the old switches, get the new chopped in, wire it, slap a bit of bonding on the chases and then second fix the accessories, quick test and dob it into the new board to leave them with lights (On a void, you'd leave the second fixing untill plasterer has been) If you wanted to do it occupied on a room by room basis, you'd have to have your feeds ready to go for the rooms you are working on, remove and joint through the old (which will probably fall apart when you try, being VIR) and install points from the new circuits.

Anything is possible, but doing it on a room by room basis rather than circuit by cirucit basis will cost significantly more

 

[Adam_151]

My advice, would be to go with the getting them to go on Holiday, find a firm that can get it done with a team of 2/3 in a week and can bring a plasterer in within that time as well, (let them sub contract the plasterer, if you try and co-ordinate two trades, things have the potential to go wrong, especially if as you say you don't really have the time in the week to deal with issues) schedule it far enough in advance that they can arrange that and the plasterer and you can arrange the holiday to co-inside, not sure if you can get there the weekend before and help them box up and move furniture, and then the following weekend to do the reverse as they return. The decorating can then be done on a room by room basis at some point in the future

 

[crystal ball]

Surface trunking, would be the quicker and much less messy way to do it, but probably will need some floorboards lifted. It could be done, designed to be later sunk into walls, on a room by room basis as they were redecorated.

An immediate quick safety fix, would be to add an RCD, to cover the entire supply.

Sticking an RCD on ancient wiring is risking nuisance tripping, they could be in darkness, my wife asked me to fit one to her parents house but talked her out of it

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Sticking an RCD on ancient wiring is risking nuisance tripping, they could be in darkness, my wife asked me to fit one to her parents house but talked her out of it

Darkness, is one step above electrocuted, or a fire due to a circuit fault.

 

[crystal ball]

Darkness, is one step above electrocuted, or a fire due to a circuit fault.

My in laws always left the hall light on overnight, if that went out my FIL would be wandering around in the dark looking for a torch and then not knowing what caused the problem, the wiring has been in place for decades, no real urgency to stick an RCD in