Putin, arse, elbow

[ajohn]

a high velocity bullet which you might think would go straight through you.

There is a feeling in the military that it's best to leave people who need treatment rather than kill them. Hence higher muzzle velocities. Not sure about now but an article about what the police use was different. Specially produced bullet with a low charge. Idea - to penetrate and not go straight through. More likely to rattle about inside. They also needed to limit power so that bullets can't go through walls. It seems that was a problem with armalites in NI. Flats were mentioned.

The other way of limiting power to go through people is lead and hollow points etc.Small entry wound and huge exits wound. Armies can't use them. Seems civilians can in some countries.

I used to do a lot of small bore target shooting long ago and a gun magazine used to arrive for us to read. Some one had developed an unstable bullet. It travelled in a sort of string of long loops. General idea, body hit, had it. Arm or leg, off it comes. I've no idea what happened to the idea.

 

[Justin Passing]

Always has been better to maim. A sniper may try to smash your thigh, etc. Was the film "killing fields" where a woman was doing that - hit one, another comes out to help so you hit his thigh as well... 4 or 5 taken off the field to manage.
A higher muzzle velocity bullet will have your leg off rather than just sit there. Assuming the shock wave doesn't kill you by mushing your lungs. Yes it's all documented online, there are fanatics about the stuff.
The blinding thing would be illegal (so what?) but very debilitating if you could "do" a few hundred at once, or pilots.

 

[ajohn]

how useful.

A stun grenade, also known as a flash grenade, flashbang, thunderflash or sound bomb,[1] is a less-lethal explosive device used to temporarily disorient an enemy's senses. It is designed to produce a blinding flash of light of around 7 megacandela (Mcd) and an intensely loud "bang" of greater than 170 decibels (dB).[2] It was first used by the British Army's Special Air Service in the late 1970s.[3]
The flash temporarily activates all photoreceptor cells in the eye, blinding it for approximately five seconds. Afterward, victims perceive an afterimage which impairs their vision. The volume of the detonation also causes temporary deafness in the victim and also disturbs the fluid in the ear, causing a loss of balance.
The concussive blast still has the ability to cause injuries, and the heat created may ignite flammable materials. The fires that occurred during the Iranian Embassy siege in London were caused by stun grenades coming into contact with flammable objects.

Perforated ear drums maybe?

 

[ajohn]

A higher muzzle velocity bullet will have your leg off rather than just sit there

Talking to people who have used guns to shoot people it depends on what it hits. They can leave a nice clean hole in and out. At extreme range when the retained energy is a lot lower things get messier. The earlier NATO round is still used. 7.62mm with ~2,500ft lb f, 2,800ft/sec or 2,600 ft/sec with a slug that is a bit heavier.

The newer one
The 5.56×45mm NATO SS109/M855 cartridge (NATO: SS109; U.S.: M855) with standard 62 gr. lead core bullets with steel penetrator will penetrate about 38 to 51 cm (15 to 20 in) into soft tissue in ideal circumstances. As with all spitzer shaped projectiles, it is prone to yaw in soft tissue. However, at impact velocities above roughly 762 m/s (2,500 ft/s), it may yaw and then fragment at the cannelure (the crimping groove around the cylinder of the bullet).[30] These fragments can disperse through flesh and bone, inflicting additional internal injuries.[31]
Fragmentation, if and when it occurs, imparts much greater damage to human tissue than bullet dimensions and velocities would suggest. This fragmentation effect is highly dependent on velocity, and therefore barrel length: short-barreled carbines generate less muzzle velocity and therefore lose wounding effectiveness at much shorter ranges than longer-barreled rifles.[32]
Proponents of the hydrostatic shock theory contend that the shockwave from a high-velocity bullet results in wounding effects beyond the tissue directly crushed and torn by the bullet and fragments.[33][34][35] However, others argue that tissue damage from hydrostatic shock is a myth. Critics argue that sonic pressure waves do not cause tissue disruption and that temporary cavity formation is the actual cause of tissue disruption mistakenly attributed to sonic pressure waves.[36]
SS109/M855 NATO ball can penetrate up to 3 mm (0.12 in) of steel at 600 meters.[37] According to Nammo, a Finnish-Norwegian ammunition producer, the 5.56×45mm NATO M995 armour piercing cartridge can penetrate up to 12 mm (0.47 in) of RHA steel at 100 meters

It can be a bit faster but the energy levels are ~1,325 ft lbs. Some army people complain about the reduced energy level jungle fighting when people are behind log type barricades. Might be why the old one is still used. Also probably the more usual sniping bullet rather than the 50 calibre shown in movies. Those are more usually used in mounted machine guns but assume high accuracy ones may be used for sniping.

In need of a life I was interested in full bore target shooting. 7.62 NATO usually up to 1,000yds but may be further in some locations.Military ranges are used,

 

[Justin Passing]

You missed the point about the bright flash I was talking about. A stun grenade is "pitiably small beer" in comparison.
Presumably it was just another irrelevant tangent as before.


If you use something below about 400nm or above about 700nm wavelength, your foe can't see it. From the shorter wavelength, things like the sclera on his eyes can fluoresce (Stokes' shift) so he knows there was something, but the iris doesn't react to either wavelength.
Shorter wavelength photons are more energetic (Planck) so more damaging, but easier to stop. If your light is focused enough then even a high attenuation leaves a dangerous level.
That leaves the victim blinded, not for a moment, but for life, or in some cases just almost blinded, for life, etc.
So the battlefield is full of invalids, the planes crash. Any inconvenient citizens who happen to be around won't be wearing anything protective, so their eyes are gone. First they think they're just blind. The pain comes later. Ever had arc-eye?

Thereafter, everyone is afraid to look up, or even go out, because a reflection can do it.
This is well researched. Decades ago tests were done on lasers as weapons. Not very good because high energy lasers excite the air molecules which become non-transparent/plasmas, so absorb the laser power over a long distance, important if you're trying it on metal. There's a name for that effect, which I forget.

Of course they're banned which means decent types wouldn't expect to have to protect against them... But the Chinese publish stuff on it.

 

[fillyboy]

Ever had arc-eye?

Oh yes.

After that I bought one of those masks, electronically controlled and darken automatically, good piece of kit.

 

[Justin Passing]

Oh yes.

After that I bought one of those masks, electronically controlled and darken automatically, good piece of kit.

Yeah, painful isn't it, the next day! And and arc isn't even designed to hurt you.
It would be a bit tricky flying a plane with the mask on.
The bright things would be useful to have at the ar5e end of your plane in a dog fight, especially if you know HE hasn't got protection against them because they're illegal...

 

[ajohn]

If you use something below about 400nm or above about 700nm wavelengt

It sounds like Regan's star wars program to me. While it may be possible there are practical difficulties. A laser for instance can burn through steel as the light can be concentrated in a very small area. The intensity relates to piR^2 and trying to produce a dead parallel beam is theoretically impossible. It will converge or diverge to some extent. I doubt if something like a search light beam is possible but the other problem as far as the eye is concerned is that it too can focus it to a very small spot. Then there is this aspect
https://www.iasj.net/iasj/download/117c3e95a0d724ca

However I did see something being used on a drone. Maybe a very bright light to spoil the cameras view. Interference type filters can be very efficient at blocking out specific wavelengths.They can also have band pass type characteristic.

I vaguely recollect Regan's stuff looked at using these to get high power levels
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_laser

 

[ajohn]

For the manic. Research may have abandoned these
https://www.laserfocusworld.com/las...211951/testing-50-kw-lasers-in-weapon-systems
and moved on to these for even more power.
https://assets.researchsquare.com/files/rs-998610/v1_covered.pdf?c=1634915943

 

[Justin Passing]

Ah, you're off on a tangent again!


"Battlefield" blinding weapons are being seen in Ukraine now .

 

[transam]

Apparently the Russians have placed mines around that Chernobyl nuclear plant ????

 

[Justin Passing]

Apparently the Russians have placed mines around that Chernobyl nuclear plant ????

Probably to stop their own grunts blundering in to it. Some of their blokes have been in high-dose areas, and churning the mud has put a spike in the radiation level. Enough to give them about 1 year to live, I read.



----

Looks like the inevitable isn't far off. Russia inches forwards, with artillery and bombs/missiles, rather WW1 style, and the Ukies run out of everything.
And we're only hearing snippets I'd bet.


If you carry a penknife and plod ever gets grouchy about it, tell them it was in case you ever came across Putin's family. Then anyone would let you off.

 

[transam]

Allegations of masse rape and sexual assault in the Ukranian areas vacated by the Russians ??

300 reported cases to date ??

UN investigating ??

Russian army

yes exactly

 

[bernardgreen]

Maybe it is time for another purge of the Russian High Command.

It is happening

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022...nce-general-in-moscow-lefortovo-prison-a77301

Colonel General Sergei Beseda, head of the Fifth Service of the FSB, is being held in Lefortovo prison.

Beseda was placed under house arrest in March. Rumor had it that Beseda fell out with Putin – it was his Fifth Service of the FSB which was largely in charge of providing intelligence about the political situation in Ukraine and, more importantly, for cultivating political support for the Kremlin in Ukraine.

The FSB tried to downplay Beseda’s arrest, presenting it as a mere questioning of the powerful general. But now I’ve learned from my sources that this “mere questioning” didn’t save Beseda from a cell in Lefortovo Prison.

 

[bernardgreen]

https://t.me/bazabazon/11198 ( auto translation ) dated 12th April

The FSB came with searches to Aeroflot. Yesterday afternoon, intelligence officers raided the company's office on the Arbat. The searches continued throughout the day.
According to the Base, one of the reasons for the search was the statements of the former deputy general director of Aeroflot Andrey Panov, as well as his position on the "special military operation in Ukraine." Baza's sources confirmed that "the searches took place precisely in Panov's patrimony." He served as Deputy CEO for Strategy, Service and Marketing from 2018 to March 2022.
Andrey Panov, who left Russia, recently wrote an op-ed in the Financial Times in which he appealed to his colleagues - senior executives and top managers of Russian companies - to "sabotage military action by postponing or ignoring every deal or contract that supports military action. or Russian propaganda.
Now Panov is in Israel. On March 12, he announced on his social networks that he quit the airline and left Russia. “We left Russia. He left Aeroflot. The old life is over," Panov wrote then.