Re-siting incoming supply

[whookam]

Hi,

We have the incoming electricity supply to our flat (and the flat upstairs) currently running directly through OUR hallway and into a cupboard accessible from the shared hallway which contains the two meters and upstairs's CU.

We have two issues. One, we would dearly love to get rid of the horrible (lead covered?) cable running through our flat as it really ruins the look of the place. Secondly, the cupboard housing the meters has technically been taken from our property and we would like this space back.

I'm hoping that we can get the incoming supply re-sited to the shared hallway and outside our flat and possibly removing the meters from the cupboard and repositioning somewhere in the shared hall.

So question is how do we go about getting this work done? Am I totally liable for the entire cost of sorting this? Are the people upstairs supposed to have the CU not actually inside their property or could they have this in the shared hallway?

Shall I just contact my DNO which I think is EDF?

Cheers,
Steve

 

[Dazz0i]

contact your energy supplier for a service move.

will cost about £700 for each one to be moved.

or, know of anyone that works for e-on? exactly legal, but many blokes on there will move a service for you on the side, will still cost about £350 each though.

 

[ColJack]

what you're suggesting is basically a forced partial rewire of the upstairs flat, if their CU is moved, their circuits will also have to be re-routed to the new site..

the cupboard hasn't been technically taken from anywhere..
if it was like that when you moved in then it's never been part of your property.. live with it..

 

[whookam]

the cupboard hasn't been technically taken from anywhere..
if it was like that when you moved in then it's never been part of your property.. live with it..

Wow, what a friendly response!

The cupboard was once part of the the property that I now own, I'm sure you know what I meant. I'm not saying I have any legal claim to it although if my upstairs neighbour was in agreement then of course I would claim the space.

I don't know what you mean by a 'forced' rewire. How can I force them to have a rewire, they either agree to it or they don't. If there is some legal reason why the current configuration isn't correct then they need to have their CU moved, so be it. We were told by an electrician (maybe untruthfully) that the our CU needed to be within our property so paid to have it moved. If everything is fine then I have no issue.

What I don't want is having a huge great cable running through my living space. Assuming Dazz0i is correct I should be able to pay to have this cable re-routed outside the flat and the neighbours shouldn't be unaffected.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

My guess is he meant "forced" as in "it would have to be rewired", not as in "I am gonna force you to rewire".

If your neighbour agrees then he isn't being coerced, but you moving the supply would force at least a partial rewire.

With your neighbour's agreement everything you want to do can be done, but you could be looking at a cost of several £'000s, depending on the state of the existing installations in the 2 flats. I guess what you have is what used to be a large house that was split into two? Historically those weren't done to the highest of standards. How old is the house, and when was it converted?

What type of CUs do you have? Some photos of them, and the service heads & meters, showing the main earthing and bonding, would be useful.

 

[Chri5]

Since all the cabling for upstairs will go upward the likely hood of being able to re-route the upstairs cables to a new CU is very good (subject to condition and age). Then a suitable set of tails, swa or con cable could link between the CU and head.

It could be argued that having a CU outside a property boundary and down the stairs isn't very friendly should a fuse pop or switch off.

If the CU wasn't ther could you live with the upstairs main head and meter, or do you really need it moving ?

A picture speaks a 1000 words, so would you please take a few so we can get a good handle on whats what.

 

[Dazz0i]

if truely serious..... speak to your neighbour.

then call your electricity provider.... i think once you get a price from then, you'll soon change your mind for the sake of the cable though.

cheaper option, box it in.

 

[ColJack]

yeah that's what I meant..

what you're effectively asking of your neighbours is..

"Hi, I have this nasty cable running through my flat and don't want it there anymore..
To make this happen I need you to pay £1000 to move your CU, and put up with the disruption and inconvenience so that I can take a little bit of the comunal space and make it mine, even though I have no legal claim to it"

 

[Dazz0i]

OP, you saying their consumer unit is in your flat?

what if their's trips and you're..... out for the day? away for the weekend? on holiday for the next few weeks?

 

[whookam]

Right, I've attempted to upload a few pictures. Excuse the crappy quality as I had to use the camera on my phone. Hopefully they'll give you SOME idea of what I mean.

I guess what you have is what used to be a large house that was split into two? Historically those weren't done to the highest of standards. How old is the house, and when was it converted?

This is the case. The house was built circa 1880 and I believe was converted in 1986. We have been slowly renovating the whole flat and the conversion seems to have been done to a very poor standard throughout. As you can see the cupboard is where the window would have been above the front door as you can still see the window frame poking out the side

what you're effectively asking of your neighbours is..

"Hi, I have this nasty cable running through my flat and don't want it there anymore..
To make this happen I need you to pay £1000 to move your CU, and put up with the disruption and inconvenience so that I can take a little bit of the comunal space and make it mine, even though I have no legal claim to it"

No, as I said in my second post this isn't the case. Its 2 separate (albeit related) issues. Should we be able to move both the meters and upstairs CU out of this cupboard and onto the wall of the shared hallway this would be perfect. This is probably unrealistic due to the cost. More than likely I would have paid for, or at least contributed to the cost of upstairs having their CU resited/replaced due to the vast improvement removing this cupboard would make to my property and having a shiny new CU in return for sacrificing a small piece shared space that they never use might have actually been worth the disruption for the neighbours. As I say, in a perfect world I would be able to throw money at this to sort it but I can't at present.

If I accept that I have to keep all the meters,cupboards and CU's where they are there is still the option of having the mains supply cable rerouted outside my flat. As far I can see this would cause the neighbour no disruption save having to have the electricity turned of for certain amount of time. I don't see what's so wrong in wanting to remove something so hideous from my property?

However having spoke to EDF the rough guide for this kind of work in £1400-£2500 pounds. Now that's a lot of money to have the cable replaced and a new one re-run outside my flat and into the existing meters. I'm going to get a free quote but assuming it's in this region then I guess boxing the cable in is my best bet. Although from the pictures you can see the cable is in an awkward place and goes into the cupboard above 6in or so away from the wall. Any ideas on a neat solution?

The cable/shielding looks pretty fragile tbh so I'm loath to go anywhere near it, but can't leave it as it is.

How cable come up through the floorboards.

How the cable goes up into the cupboard.

Upstairs's CU in cupboard

Our CU inside our flat.

The cupboard from within our flat. Opens out into shared hallway.

 

[Dazz0i]

balls to moving that even for £200 quid.

plasterboard, bag of bonding compound and half a metre of new skirting and i could make that disapear! £20!

 

[Steve]

Aah I think I understand. The door to the left of the cable and box is your entrance door. The other side of the entrance door is the shared hallway and (presumably) stairs to upstairs. The access to the meter cupboard is via the "window" frame on the left.

Those cables are very fragile sometimes, I'm surprised they were still fitting them in the 80's (unless the meter was always there).

Can you not just box in the cable? IMO its in the perfect position to box in. You just need a right angle of board and a few bits of batten.

Fire protection is questionnable. The ceiling between the 2 flats should be half hour fire rated, but its got dirty big holes in it . . .

IMO, this cupboard is not your property, it is shared space. I dont think its gonna happen. By all means tidy it up from your side, but I dont think the neighbours will agree to moving it. Any move will likely involve a new supply from the road.

 

[whookam]

balls to moving that even for £200 quid.

plasterboard, bag of bonding compound and half a metre of new skirting and i could make that disapear! £20!

Heh, yeah. The angle of the cable makes it little less straightforward (comes out further than the pillar to the left) but yeah its not a massive job to box and I'm more than comfortable with this kind of work. But you can see why I'd like that window!!! The amount of light it would let in would transform the hallway.

We've got the rest of the flat looking really nice with very little compromise and the hallway is the last bit to do so it bugs me when I can't get things as good as they could be.

IMO, this cupboard is not your property, it is shared space. I dont think its gonna happen. By all means tidy it up from your side, but I dont think the neighbours will agree to moving it. Any move will likely involve a new supply from the road.

Yeah, just too damn pricey.

 

[Chri5]

It would not be difficult to box that in and make it look good by adding in new dado and skirt to match existing.

Box work looks carp when builder done, but take that up a level by adding back dado and skirt over the box and it will melt in to obvilion. Check out your local wood merchant, if all the local property have similar dado and skirt it will be an easy match up.

It will also offer an advantage in as much as you will add a shield /protection to the cable.


It would still be worth having the survey, tea and biscuits could charm the DNO in to accepting that the cable is beyond service life and certainly not up to 100a standard (although being in a flat you shouldn't need anymore than 65a).

I'd push on the "how's about accepting the cable replacement is in the interest of the DNO being able to offer a realiable, safe, modern service on a new cable + offering the dig and internal property" route.

Sometimes it helps- you might get 50-50 on the cost.

There's still the neighbours stuff to think about and since its been the same since 1986, the service cupboard issue could be like the squatters law right. Unless you complained within 11 years of build law will see the neighbours meter as on common property.

 

[kkynaston]

Personally I would be a bit worried boxing it in, especially when you come home after the Mrs has tried to hang a small picture with a 2" nail and penetrated the service cable

I would go with Chri5's suggestion of trying to persuade the DNO that the cable is beyond servicable life, even if they reroute it to the cupboard from the outside your flat