Salamander pump

[rockycat]

Please bear with me, I know absolutely nothing about plumbing and am just trying to identify who needs to be called out to come and help!

We've just had a new shower installed upstairs. Our hot water tank is downstairs, so the plumber installed an ESP CPV Salamander pump for negative (I think) systems, in the attic that backs on to the shower room.

Initially the shower would be either freezing cold or scalding hot, and when we used the hot tap in the sink it would be fine for approx 40 seconds and then the pump would stop making the noise, the water pressure dropped and the water cooled. The number 2 LCD on the pump lit up and we had to switch it off to reset it. The plumber said the pump must be faulty and ordered a replacement under our guarantee.

The new pump has been installed and now the shower and taps work fine, but the pump comes on intermittently throughout the day for a few seconds at a time, when nobody is using any water.

It would seem unlikely that this pump is also faulty, but the plumber is insisting the installation is fine. Does anyone have any ideas?

Many thanks.

 

[seco services]

is the pressure vessel on the side up to the right pressure ?

 

[linkyplumb]

Are there any air vents installed on the pipework from the pump to the shower?
Could be a small amount of air in the pipes/pump.
Also where is the hot feed to the pump,plumbed in on the cylinder .Should be at the very top for peak performance.
Regards
Graham

 

[doitall]

Two reasons I know for the problem.

A dripping tap.

A secondary circuit.

Faulty pump.

Poor/terrible installation, in the worse place possible.

 

[kevplumb]

err thats 3

 

[rockycat]

is the pressure vessel on the side up to the right pressure ?

Thanks for your quick response. Like I said, I am a complete amateur: I can see from the manual which part the pressure vessel is, but how would I know if it was set at the right pressure?

Thanks again.

 

[rockycat]

Are there any air vents installed on the pipework from the pump to the shower?
Could be a small amount of air in the pipes/pump.
Also where is the hot feed to the pump,plumbed in on the cylinder .Should be at the very top for peak performance.
Regards
Graham

Thank you. I can't see anything that looks like air vents, but a lot of the pipework is behind plasterboard and not accessible without cutting out some of the plaster (which the plumber has already done once, much to our joy!).

I think the hot feed is plumbed in at the top, but I might be looking at the wrong thing because I can't see how it could be plumbed in anywhere else At the hot pump end as shown in the picture I have in the manual there is a vertical copper pipe that goes straight up for about 40cms, then has a right angle to the right (the direction in which our shower is).

Sorry for being so ignorant, really appreciate the help.

 

[rockycat]

Two reasons I know for the problem.

A dripping tap.

A secondary circuit.

Faulty pump.

Poor/terrible installation, in the worse place possible.

Thanks. No dripping tap. What's a secondary circuit?

Thanks again.

 

[lufcmark]

Even though they can be a nightmare to contact, Salamander's technical helpline staff are usually very helpful...They might suggest fitting non return valves to the OUTLET side of the pump...I have done this for similar problems with a positive head shower pump but I am not sure if the same applies for your negative head pump.

 

[rockycat]

Thanks. I think I'm going to have to get the plumbers back and ask them to phone Salamander. Tonight the shower has gone back to being either scalding hot or freezing cold

 

[JayJay1978]

I wonder how much money Salamander looses each year due to replacing pumps in perfect working order, no wonder they're so strict regarding the guarantee.

It sounds like these poor installers are costing them a fortune, if you ring Salamander tech (Pimpwise) they will take you're pumps serial number and ask the exact details of your installation, if no essex/surrey flange is used or anything else they don't like the sound of your garantee will be void, then they will quickley realise that they've sent you a new pump to replace a perfectly good one (albiet piped wrong) and may charge you for it.

Be warned.

 

[rockycat]

I know, and the annoying thing is that they strongly advise you to phone them for help with the installation, but I've a feeling our plumber had too much pride to do that. Fortunately for us this was part of a bigger renovation project and we still owe the plumber's employer a lot more than the cost of a pump, so we will fight tooth and nail not to be out of pocket.

Thanks for the warning.

 

[JayJay1978]

I used the term 'poor installers' in my last post, he may be a good guy for all I know and its probably not fair make such a statement without knowing all the facts.

Did he use an essex flange though? one of these.

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Heating/Central+Heating/Essex+Flange+15mm/d230/sd2708/p70202

Edit the link shows a 15mm, it should be 22mm DOH!

 

[rockycat]

I have absolutely no idea. The renovation work was so major that we had to vacate the house for 6 weeks so the majority of the work went on without us seeing it, not that we would have had much idea anyway.

I've asked his boss what he wants us to do next as the plumber is now blaming the shower itself, but Aqualisa will charge us if they come out and it turns out not to be the shower.

 

[JayJay1978]

If you have a digital camera a nice clear picture of the hot water cylinder would be great. Is there a 22mm pipe coming out of the top 3rd of the cylinder? If may have the foam lagging roughly cut away around it.

If not is there a brass fitting at the top of the cylinder with a vertical and horizontal pipe coming out of it?

If none of these it dosn't look good.