Savile again

[alumni]

Like I said, if that quote was accurate and I have no reason to doubt it, David Jordan has already stated it about Savile.

Yet you yourself say you watched a video and confirmed he did NOT say what that "quote" suggested.

I haven't postulated any scenario, except the one that Savile was a beast in many different scenarios come to that. His car, his caravan, his flat, his dressing room to name a few.

Clearly you are keeping an open mind and happy to consider all available information. Not for you this jumping to conclusions eh?

Are you saying that those interviews given by former presenters cast any doubt at all on Saviles guilt?

Nice try. I'm saying nothing of the sort. I'm saying there is information/claims/statement available that suggests different to what some journalists wish to promote.
The fact that this contradicts your blinkered thinking doesn't make it any less valid, no matter how much you try and discount it.

 

[sooey]

Yet you yourself say you watched a video and confirmed he did NOT say what that "quote" suggested.

Yes, the obvious conclusion is that the quote was taken from a different interview.

Clearly you are keeping an open mind and happy to consider all available information. Not for you this jumping to conclusions eh?

His statue in scotland has been taken down.
His memorial plaque has been vandalised and removed.
His headstone is placed under security to prevent vandalism.
Streetsigns named for him have been removed.
The NSPCC and various MPs have called for his knighthood to be removed.
His own charities have said they are going to remove his name from their titles and give money to abused childrens charities.
Various well known showbusiness insiders have told the world what he was like. As well as relating how he would use the threat of libel damages and the threat of his charity money drying up to quosh newspaper interest.
Various newspaper people have backed that up.
He was a known visitor to Haute de la garenne, but denied it.
A shedload of different people have now come forward and accused him.
Other people have accused him as witnesses.

If I'm jumping to conclusions by not waiting for a guilty verdict which can never come I'm hardly alone.

It's very boring now and that is my last word on it.

 

[Paul Barker]

May I please comment on my original post about Jimmy Saville.

I hadn't at that time heard any first hand experiences of abuse. This morning I watched on ITVPlayer the relevant documentary and have no doubt in my mind he was a child abuser.

When I was aged 8 to 12 my Grandmother used to say "why don't you go down to the marine drive and run round with Jimmy Saville, he runs round with children every morning." I didn't fancy geting up that early or running in any case. But I could myself fortunate not to have had anything to do with any of his public face with children when I was a child. But I had no concept of this sort of activity as I am sure most other people who put him on a pedestal that did get involved had no concept either.

I fully understand the position of the victims not speaking. When 15 at a friends house where his father I now understand groomed me, made attampts to fondle my privates in the same way these girls describe Jimmy Saville did to them, though I fought this man off I was 40 miles from home deep in the country without transport inside the home of this powerful man. Nothing happened but attempts were made. I cannot explain to you even this day and I have never had an explanation, why I never told a living sole. Now I am 55 I have only recently mentioned it to a few trusted friends.

I don't feel scarred by it or a victim, after all nothing happened.

What I don't comprehend is why I was silent.

therefore I more than most fully understand why these girls have only now come out!!!!!!

I was in floods of tears as I watched this program.

I think the biggest lesson we can learn as a nation is children ever need support but never by a single adult alone whether same sex or otherwise, in depth support by trained people to change their responses in these situations which I have no doubt continue. You will never stop the predator but you can help the children fight their corner. I fought my corner physically I had to wrestle this man off his grabbing motions four times if I had not fought him he would have engaged me in sexual contact there was no doubt about that. Children have to be helped even if we think they need no help. People must be raised up with the knowledge experience and skill to empower children against this predatory attention. Perhaps the trustees of any fortunes left by JS could consider financing such objectives.

 

[Big Tone]

Thanks for that Paul. I’m both sorry and saddened about what you went through. Again, I’m not on Saville’s side, I’m simply questioning the trail by media and rationale behind the conclusions people are jumping to.

For instance.. If all it takes for someone to be 100% convinced of anything, (like Sooey is with Saville’s guilt), are numbers of people let’s say greater than a million all in agreement, then why isn’t he a Christian or Muslim?

 

[chapeau]

Big Tone,

Explain why he was chucked out of the Stoke Mandeville nurses home for bringing back little boys.

 

[Big Tone]

Big Tone,

Explain why he was chucked out of the Stoke Mandeville nurses home for bringing back little boys.

I’ve read that too chapeau. I don’t know is the honest answer. But it begs a full enquiry to get at the facts, which is what I hope they do.

Being with children, even on your own, isn’t on and in itself a crime otherwise I’d be on a sex offenders list.

Edit/add: Woffle mode ON...

I only spawned one child, a daughter called Vanessa, and when she was little she had friends who would come out along with me and ‘Ness’. Sometimes they would have a stop-over, I think they call it.

Looking back it was very trusting of their parents but it sends a shiver up my spine to think that if one of them said I touched them inappropriately I’d have no defence whatsoever. And you can bet I would have been guilty until proven innocent with remarks like “well what’s a grown man having children over for anyway?”

Luckily, they knew me for who I am. In fact when I worked in America for two years my daughter and her bestist friend came over to stay with me and my, then, girlfriend. I don’t think I’d do anything like that again because the world has changed and it could be a very different story today, sadly.

Us men aren’t all pervs but, as often is the case, one spoils it for the genuine others. Back in the 80’s was a time when about every other week there was a peado-priest in the news. I sometimes used to feel awkward picking Vanessa up from church, as I did, because she’d sit on my lap and throw her arms around me with a kiss. I felt like people were watching and judging me.

I imagine every father today feels like he’s walking on eggshells just by being with his own daughter or around other children. This is partly why, although I too think he’s as guilty as hell, it’s only right and fair to wait for all the facts to come out before we start burning effigies of him.

 

[alumni]

Big Tone,

Explain why he was chucked out of the Stoke Mandeville nurses home for bringing back little boys.

Perhaps it would be better for stoke mandeville to explain why they didn't report him and/or press charges.

 

[Big Tone]

Quite Alumni. The whole theme of this thread, (and the other one), has been an incessant vilification of J.S. but no one taking responsibility for allowing a perv to carry on his ways.

Surely, now that he’s dead, the emphasis should be on the later? As said here already, there must be a lot of nervous people out there over this..

 

[joe-90]

And poor sooty and sweep. The was a culture of abuse in those days.

 

[Nige F]

No wonder Sooty couldn`t speak

 

[Big Tone]

I wonder where the headstone is; what the family have done with it?

They should put it in a public toilet where people can pee on it...

 

[jeds]

Usual media circus. They're fixated on Saville because of who he was. They'll wheel out any number of cranks looking for attention to help them embelish their paper-wasting little rags and the genuine victims will be lost in the frenzy.

My question is what about the ones still with us. Saville is dead and gone so will never be properly investigated or tested in court, but these people are still with us living it up on grossly over inflated BBC salaries and pensions. When are they going to be flushed out of the dung heap.

 

[alumni]

Usual media circus. They're fixated on Saville because of who he was. They'll wheel out any number of cranks looking for attention to help them embelish their paper-wasting little rags and the genuine victims will be lost in the frenzy.

My question is what about the ones still with us. Saville is dead and gone so will never be properly investigated or tested in court, but these people are still with us living it up on grossly over inflated BBC salaries and pensions. When are they going to be flushed out of the dung heap.

And that is why some of us have been advising caution.

If the allegations are true, then someone has some serious explaining to do and with luck, they'll have plenty of time and solitude to reflect on it.

 

[securespark]

I think the reason this has all come out now is that the spell Savile cast over victims and colleagues alike has been broken upon his death.

Only on DIYnot would I say this; in between the slagging off, vitriol, you’re a nob he’s a nob and blah blah blah. I don’t know who I’m agreeing or disagreeing with!

You do know what you get when you've abused children and then died before they found out what you'd done?

Away with it. Theres bugger all you can do about it now.

Well yes and no...

No, you can’t hold him to account because he’s dead; to state the obvious.

Yes, you can affect his legacy and alter the latest Wiki entry to something like “outed as a disgusting pervert!". Or in years to come, stripped of titles & charities he founded or subscribed to were disbanded or changed to reflect his disgusting behaviour. In 2015 the Queen herself commented on what a despicable person he was and he should never have been knighted.

See were I’m going with this?

Of course it matters after Saville’s death. Next question....

But there's a bigger picture.

Of course, it goes without saying that what has happened to the victims of JS is truly horrific, but he is now dead and we may never know the full truth of what happened or the extent of his crimes.

However, we owe it to all those victims who have come forward (and those who have yet to), alleging abuse by persons still living, to carry out a full and open investigation into those allegations.

EDIT: I'm sorry, jeds.

I must make a New Year's resolution not to post in a thread without reading all the posts first.

 

[sooey]

I wonder where the headstone is; what the family have done with it?

They should put it in a public toilet where people can pee on it...

That sounds like you've decided he was a perv tone. What happened to this "legal process" then?