Security flaw with keyfobs?

[NewOrder]

Up this late removing a rootkit from a PC my customer wants back tomorrow, while I am watching paint dry I have been thinking....

Having finally settled on a powermax system and now going to spend £350.00. Two door contacts, external siren, 3 PIRs and a wireless commander.

Anyway I was thinking with the keyfob (never seen one in my life) there is a major flaw in that if the burglars break into the house and steal your keys they can instantly disarm the alarm?

Also if you loose your keys and the person knows where you live they could also disarm your alarm.

Or do you some how have to key in a code on the keyfob to disarm it?

 

[lee2009]

from what i am aware some systems are fob followed by code, or can be set to fob only.

i have a fob system, but will not be setting it to fob only de arm.

 

[alarmisafool]

Yes proximity tags are a huge security risk. However the powers that be ie the police and insurance companies prefer them because it cuts down false alarms by people forgetting codes.

lose your keys or if a lady has her handbag stolen with her house keys in it then . . happy days for the thieves.

Had a system recently which used poxy tags as I call them and the place had a high turnover of staff... once someone had walked out or left there was basically no security for the place if they hadn't handed the prox tag back. You could not even change the code.

There was a prox tag for the security gate too..which could be prized open and the innards removed and then clicked back together. So anyone could have taken the insides out and handed back the empty tag. rubbish.

 

[bernardgreen]

Any alarm is fooled by mis-managment of people involved with the alarm system. The better the system the harder it is to fool it.

Lost keys are not a risk if there is no way to link the bunch of keys to the premises they unlock. If here has to be a return address on the keys then use a safe place such as a bank or a solicitor who can then contact the owner to say the keys have been handed in. Same for proximity fobs.

A good system will have the means inform the system of lost fobs so the system will no longer respond to them ( other than to covertly alert security staff that a lost or stolen fob is being used which may result in the person being caught ).

no security for the place if they hadn't handed the prox tag back.

If all the proximity tags have the same identity then the system is flawed from the day it was installed.

A good quality fob or tag would be designed in such a way that opening it would damage it to the point it can no longer operate. Extremely careful dismantling might be possible but not without the detailed knowldege of how it was constructed, in which case the person would more easily use that knowledge to construct their own fobs and clone a recognised e identity into them.

 

[alumni]

Had a system recently which used poxy tags as I call them and the place had a high turnover of staff... once someone had walked out or left there was basically no security for the place if they hadn't handed the prox tag back. You could not even change the code.

There was a prox tag for the security gate too..which could be prized open and the innards removed and then clicked back together. So anyone could have taken the insides out and handed back the empty tag. rubbish.

You clearly don't understand 'Access Control.
If the customer fits Gade 1 kit where the requirements clearly demand Grade 3. Why is it the system at fault?
Just because you haven't seen all the system or are not aware of it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Like Bernard says, human factor is usually the weak link.

I'm going to a site this morning where people 'leaving the business' cannot get out without the assistance of security - Who have already been informed and the user card disabled.

 

[alumni]

no security for the place if they hadn't handed the prox tag back.

If all the proximity tags have the same identity then the system is flawed from the day it was installed.

And no responsible manufacturer or supplier would provide them either. We got requests occasionally so people do ask, but always get the same answer.

 

[alarmisafool]

The original poster is going to fit his own grade 2 system.

It is a domestic property therefore it is feasible for any of the residents to lose their fobs or have them stolen. The holder would then be able to access the home before anyone had chance to return and disable specific fobs.

When you talk about an alarm in a shared property then alarms don't actually prevent burglaries. The problem being that because people are always in and out of the property it is very rare the system can ever be set. Students have different lecture times and days and it is rare where everyone will be in the home and have the alarm set or everyone will be out and have the alarm set.

Far better would be individual alarms for each room like appartments and a row of four sirens for example on the home front.

This could be easily achieved.



The grade 2 system I am on about was fitted by a professional installer who is ssia registered but he did not make a user log and just sent left a load of keyfobs preprogrammed into the system.

 

[Alarm]

Down to the end user to make logs of who has what.

Your not very good a this lark are you.

Awaits another name change by Yaleguy. Not a good way to advertise F*** Alarms or Yale is this.