Solar Photovoltaic Microgeneration.

[bernardgreen]

One of our local wind farm supporters was asked if they would be willing to loose electrical power to thier house if there was no wind, " Of course not " was the immediate (and truthfu)l answer.

as i said Bas, its all in the transmition, the worls willl find a way. and if you dig into your inner most talent, you know it.

Electrical power doesn't travel that well. Losses in transmission are significant.

One way to "protect" the future is to re-think not how to generate the power we want but to re-think about how much power we need.

History proves that life was possible without electrical power and motor transport.

Re-think how much we need and how much we want and then meet our needs and not our wants.

 

[Trog]

Myself I think that micro PV is both morally and practically wrong. There is just not the sunlight to make it work, and the wealth transferal from poor to rich for no good reason is just wrong.

If the government wants to go green we should be building reliable and predictable tidal power installations, coupled to pump storage systems, so that when low tide is at 2am the power generated can be stored for the morning rush. As high tide is not at the same time in all places it also might be possible to set up three or four such systems in such a way as to give a reasonably constant flow of power.

We should also be cutting down on waste, subsidise people to insulate their homes, factories and offices. Where industry creates a lot of waste heat, could it be used to heat nearby homes, or recovered and turned into useable power. Commission our universities to research better LED lights, super conductor electricity transmission, etc etc.


We should also build a new generation of atomic power stations, to replace the existing old ones. With a proper waste storage facility built to the highest standards. So the waste can be stored in such a way that it would be safe if left alone for millenia, but can be retrieved for repacking if and when required.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

as i said Bas, its all in the transmition, the worls willl find a way. and if you dig into your inner most talent, you know it.

The world will find a way to make tiny, domestic-scale fixed orientation PV panels on the roofs of people's house in a temperate, fairly rainy country between 50° and 59° North produce electricity in worthwhile amounts, with a predictability which can be used for planning, and at an economic price, will it?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

History proves that life was possible without electrical power and motor transport.

1) For a much smaller population.

2) At a much lower standard.

 

[Stoday]

Who's talking about turning off power stations? It's this sort of comment which turns debate into pointless noise. But in planning for the future it's worth bearing in mind how much of our gas and oil (and uranium) comes from other countries, and question how much power we could generate if those countries decided to hang on to it for their own use.

As much as we want, actually.

There's an abundant supply of coal left in the ground since generation from coal became obsolete because cheaper fuels became available from foreign countries.

.

 

[17thman]

http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/Eurotunnel-carry-electricity-tele-1616272985.html

this is what we need to cover diversity. in the future with super conductivity, transmittion will allow it. its always sunny somewhere in the world.

 

[simond]

We shunt natural gas all over the World but it doesnt make it cheaper.

The half a Gigawatt cable is a convenience for the electricity grid owners, not a way of reducing end cost.

I am a PV installer and I agree that the distribution of wealth that the FiT gives is morally wrong. I also think that the way commercial windfarms are subsidised in the UK is just the same, it is taking money out of the less well off to fund the rich.

There is no esy way to stop this; when the government ran the boiler scrappage scheme last year, most of our customers were wealthy people with the spare cash to bag the £400 incentive.


My house is being fitted with PV because I like to use the technology I sell, and I don't want to miss on the excellent RoI the feed in tariff gives. If you cant beat them, join them.

 

[EFLImpudence]

it is taking money out of the less well off to fund the rich.

That's how the system works.

If you cant beat them, join them.

Honest of you but that's just because you're not used to doing it.

 

[Stoday]

.
I don't want to miss on the excellent RoI the feed in tariff gives.

Investing in a depreciating asset is not the same as investing in a bond or share. You can't get your money back from a depreciating asset and in the case of pv you're unlikely to be able to sell it.

Getting 8% p.a. on the capital cost of a pv installation is not the same as getting 8% on an investment in bonds/shares/savings.

How risky is it? No one knows. How long will the installation last? No one knows because they haven't been in production long enough to identify all the bugs. Will it generate as much as the manufacturer says it will? Throughout its life? What maintenance will it need?

There's always a risk with new technology. When the copper price rocketed towards the end of the last centuary, aluminum house cables became available. Not this time because we experienced the problems of new (aluminium house cables) technology. The first jet airliner (The Comet) had a fatal fault (metal fatigue) that resulted in the manufacturer going bust.

Viewed as an investment, the 8% RoI has to be compared with the alternatives, taking risk into account. In my view it makes the horses attractive.

 

[simond]

How risky is it? No one knows. How long will the installation last? No one knows because they haven't been in production long enough to identify all the bugs. Will it generate as much as the manufacturer says it will? Throughout its life? What maintenance will it need?

We know the answers to these questions. If you use a manufacturer such as Mitsubishi for your panels you have the confidence that they have been making them in large volumes for over 30 years. Many of their Solar PV panels are currently orbiting the earth enabling your Sky TV, telephone conversations etc.

It takes a very long ladder to fix them, so there is a great deal of confidence in the panels.

Many Solar PV installers are using cheaper or apparently more efficient products sourced from the Far East, from companies that didn't exist 5 yrs ago. Now THAT is a risk; but like all things, if you choose wisely the risk is minimised.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I am a PV installer and I agree that the distribution of wealth that the FiT gives is morally wrong.

Bur you are happy to profit from it.

There's a word for people like you, but this forum doesn't like the plain truth to be written.

I don't want to miss on the excellent RoI the feed in tariff gives. If you cant beat them, join them.

Like I said.

(It rhymes with "plum", BTW.)

 

[simond]

You can describe me how you like, rhyming if necessary.

I believe that Solar PV is the only renewable form of energy that can cover its investment. This is only achievable by the Feed in Tariffs because the price of the panels is so high.

Governments move 'funny money' around in huge quantities that the man in the street can only marvel at; this is just another one of those transactions.

I am not sure it is costing our taxpayers any more than bombing Libya.

But we will be left with a large swathe of properties contributing to the grid, and raising awareness about wasting electricity. When we fit these things, we use iPhone and Bluetooth monitoring. People appreciate how much of their precious generating energy they are wasting. Owners of Solar PV are therefore also amongst the early adopters of LED lighting technology.

So maybe you think I'm a plum. I care not.

 

[Stoday]

Hooray!
Germany has declared that it will shut down all its nuclear electricity generating plants by 2022. That means that their manufacturing plant will find its costs going into orbit and Britain recovering its industrial base.

Britain will at last be able to become the leading power in Europe, as it should have after the end of WW2.

 

[Stoday]

Mitsubishi has made mistakes.

The Mitsubishi Pajero was one. When they started to sell it in Spain they found that "pajero" was the spanish for w*nker.

 

[simond]

If that is the best bit of dirt about Mitsubishi you can come up with, I rest my case.


If I recall correctly, the story you give is not correct. Mitsubishi had to rename Shogun as the Pajero in Spain, because of the connotations.