Spray foam questions- looking at new house

[Alex Horne]

Hello all,

Thanks in advance for reading this. I am looking for some guidance...

My partner and I are in the process of buying a new house. Everything is going ok but we have just had the Homebuyers report done and it highlighted a few problems. The house is a 1900 Victorian Terraced (End of Terrace). The report highlighted the potential for rising damp (we are going to get a damp specialist to look at this) and also a problem with spray foam in the roof.

The roof space has been "enhanced" and is not a saleable room, I have been up there, there is drop down stairs and it is carpeted etc. It is like a room but not classified as one in the sale. No building regs were consented for this but I understand this is ok as its not classified as a bedroom?

That was one of the points from the surveyor about building regs but understand this is quite common in a survey?

The next point was stated as "Roof coverings - the underside of which have been sprayed with foam, with the potential to cause rot to the rafters and battens due to severely restricted ventilation"

I have looked into this and there are a lot of articles explaining the problems with using this foam and lack of ventilation etc. I put this to the seller and have had the response below, can someone please let me know there thoughts on this and whether it will still cause an issue?

3. Roof coverings - the underside of which have been sprayed with foam, with the potential to cause rot to the rafters and battens due to severely restricted ventilation[Vendor] Rafters are treated with to prevent rot, foam has been placed to enhance the structural capability of the roof coverings, ventilation to the area has been maintained, the roof was repointed and repaired at the time of the spray insulation. [Me] Are there any photos or documentation showing the work done in the roof space in general and the date of works? In particular how ventilation was maintained with foam being sprayed to the underside of the roof tiles and to what extent the roof was repaired/ repointed?[Vendor] Work to the roofing space was carried out 2008, I cannot locate documentation for the works at this time but if this is an issue I will endeavour to contact the company that undertook the works and ask them to provide.

The spray foam is only to the underside of the roof coverings, it in essence replaces the insulation normal required within the roof construction and assists in maintaining the roof coverings, the natural ventilation to the area through the eaves is maintained, the timbers to the loft area are not encased in the foam (the foam is placed between the rafters) to ensure that the timber can breathe. There is a membrane between the spray foam and the tiles to allow natural ventilation to occur. (for reference see image below.

The complete roof was repaired and repointing was carried out the chimney stack and the party wall above the roof coverings. The eaves and facia was also replaced with uPVC at that time and the existing gutter replaced.

Thanks in advance for any comments.

 

[flameport]

The report highlighted the potential for rising damp (we are going to get a damp specialist to look at this)

Don't bother. The house has been there for over 120 years without any rising damp. It won't suddenly appear now.

No building regs were consented for this but I understand this is ok as its not classified as a bedroom?

It's ok in the sense that it is no better now than before the floor, carpet etc. were installed - for the purposes of buying the property, the roof room does not exist and has added zero value.

The spray foam was/is sold to people as a quick fix to 'repair' defective roof coverings by gluing loose slates, tiles etc. in place and avoiding the cost of a new roof.
Therefore expect to have the entire roof replaced in the near future, and amend the price paid for the property accordingly.

Rafters are treated with to prevent rot
With proper ventilation, that would not be necessary.

foam has been placed to enhance the structural capability of the roof coverings
The roof was falling apart and foam has been sprayed on in a feeble attempt to hold it together.

ventilation to the area has been maintained
Impossible.

the roof was repointed and repaired at the time of the spray insulation
The loose slates were shoved back into place before the foam was applied.

I cannot locate documentation for the works at this time
There are no documents

the company that undertook the works
They went bust and have reincarnated themselves several times with similar names.

 

[Nige F]

Indeed - and price for a proper slate roof too ! If it was me I'd want best quality reclaimed Welsh slate

 

[Alex Horne]

Don't bother. The house has been there for over 120 years without any rising damp. It won't suddenly appear now.


It's ok in the sense that it is no better now than before the floor, carpet etc. were installed - for the purposes of buying the property, the roof room does not exist and has added zero value.

The spray foam was/is sold to people as a quick fix to 'repair' defective roof coverings by gluing loose slates, tiles etc. in place and avoiding the cost of a new roof.
Therefore expect to have the entire roof replaced in the near future, and amend the price paid for the property accordingly.

Rafters are treated with to prevent rot
With proper ventilation, that would not be necessary.

foam has been placed to enhance the structural capability of the roof coverings
The roof was falling apart and foam has been sprayed on in a feeble attempt to hold it together.

ventilation to the area has been maintained
Impossible.

the roof was repointed and repaired at the time of the spray insulation
The loose slates were shoved back into place before the foam was applied.

I cannot locate documentation for the works at this time
There are no documents

the company that undertook the works
They went bust and have reincarnated themselves several times with similar names.

Thanks very much for your help, this is exactly what we will do.

What would you say is a good estimate on the price of a new roof, please see pic below to property to give you a rough idea of size.

 

[Alex Horne]

Indeed - and price for a proper slate roof too ! If it was me I'd want best quality reclaimed Welsh slate

Haha, yes I think we prefer that

 

[big-all]

the new roof will cost far more with the foam in place as it will take far longer to do the job and use more materials

 

[Alex Horne]

the new roof will cost far more with the foam in place as it will take far longer to do the job and use more materials

Ok thanks, property is below. What do you think with the foam in place. 8-10k?

 

[big-all]

i dont know to be honest but i would ask the seller if they have had any quoted to replace or repair the roof and see what they say
if they say yes i would ask when and why
if they say no i would ask if there report when they bought the house had highlighted the problem??

as an aside
a correct loft conversion will now cost more as work so far done will in the most have to be ripped out and done properly
so dont think its a part done job its not

 

[Alex Horne]

i dont know to be honest but i would ask the seller if they have had any quoted to replace or repair the roof and see what they say
if they say yes i would ask when and why
if they say no i would ask if there report when they bought the house had highlighted the problem??

as an aside
a correct loft conversion will now cost more as work so far done will in the most have to be ripped out and done properly
so dont think its a part done job its not

Ok thanks for the info. I think I am going to reduce our offer by the amount required for a new roof and see what happens. I have a feeling they'll turn it down but not too bothered. Its just annoying paying out for the costs we have so far.

 

[Nige F]

Also knock some £££ of to replace that hideous front door with fake band hinges and a fanlight IN it. But maybe keep an eye on it in your searching - because the vendors may one day realise they need to drop.

 

[OwainDIYer]

Ok thanks, property is below. What do you think with the foam in place. 8-10k?

There is no easy way to remove the foam from the timbers so the entire roof trusses and upstairs ceilings might have to be replaced and you find somewhere else to live while the work is done. And if it's in England you'll probably need a Party Wall Act negotiation with the neighbour who can hold you to ransom for consent and costs.

If these are the visible bodges I'd be very worried what has been hidden (or what essential work has been omitted).

I'd be looking for at least £30k below market value before I'd even consider it.