Trying to identify my underfloor heating cold tails

[Ges1]

HI everyone,

We bought a house about five years ago, and it has a freezing cold kitchen, which we later learned has underfloor heating that was apparently damaged during a flood. Something tells me this isn't the case, and that it was just the electrics above surface that got damaged. I have done some investigation, and have uncovered a junction box under the kitchen cabinets that feeds into the wall. It's 6mm T&E.



Here you can see it going into the junction and emerging from the wall. This is under the kitchen units. It's not live.

At the consumer unit, the cable emerges, and goes into another junction box, with another piece of 6mm coming out with "underfloor heating" written on it. The cable has been cut and taped. Presumably, this went into a breaker at some point



My problem is that I cannot find where the underfloor heating would actually connect to this junction box.. the only thing under here that even looks remotely possible is this cutout in the kitchen tile:



I'm trying to put all this together to see how I can prove the heating still works, but finding the cold tails is my problem.

If anyone can shed some light based on these images, I'd appreciate it, I get there's little to go on!

Thanks

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

I'm trying to put all this together to see how I can prove the heating still works, but finding the cold tails is my problem.

You would need to both check the continuity of the circuit, and the insulation resistance, before even considering whether it was worthwhile pursuing.

 

[CountryFan]

I’m guessing with the copper it’s wet underfloor heating (ufh)? If so, surely new electrics could be run to it?

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

I’m guessing with the copper it’s wet underfloor heating (ufh)? If so, surely new electrics could be run to it?

If it were wet underfloor heating, then it certainly wouldn't need a 6mm cable to feed it.

 

[SUNRAY]

If it were wet underfloor heating, then it certainly wouldn't need a 6mm cable to feed it.

always possible it was a repurposed cooker circuit

 

[Ges1]

I’m guessing with the copper it’s wet underfloor heating (ufh)? If so, surely new electrics could be run to it?

That's a gas line, unrelated to the heating

But as per my question, I'm trying to figure out where the cold tails are to connect the power to

 

[Ges1]

You would need to both check the continuity of the circuit, and the insulation resistance, before even considering whether it was worthwhile pursuing.

The circuit is fine, I need to figure out where the cold tails are on the floor, but I don't know what they look like, and the picture are all I have to go on

 

[ericmark]

There are two types of electric under floor heating, one uses resistive cable, the other some chemical impregnation, the former needs sensors to stop the floor over heating the latter one does not.

I fitted the former type to a wet room, there were three connections line, neutral and earth. The instructions required insulation to be fitted first, so when it failed the floor was still warm.

Since you say "it has a freezing cold kitchen" I would think something wrong with the installation, not just disconnected.

The tester

is not cheap, so likely cheaper to get an electrician.

 

[Ges1]

Ok, that’s great, but my question is about locating the cold tails, so I’m not sure what that has to do with what I asked.

Sorry to seem blunt, but I feel like the question I’ve asked is so far the only thing that hasn’t been addressed

 

[Murdochcat]

IF there is electric under floor heating in the kitchen where is the controller for it?

 

[CountryFan]

That's a gas line, unrelated to the heating

Ok, well those cables are touching the pipe and should be 25mm away from it.

But as per my question, I'm trying to figure out where the cold tails are to connect the power to

I don’t the think I’ve heard electric tails being called cold before. What I think you need to do is either contact the previous homeowner if possible or investigate more where the cables run.

 

[Ges1]

IF there is electric under floor heating in the kitchen where is the controller for it?

Yeah, that's the real kicker here. The whole thing was ripped out after the flood, but when I look at the way most of the electrics have been wired in this house, I can't help but feel it was a reactive measure and not one taken because the heating elements were actually damaged.

 

[Ges1]

Ok, well those cables are touching the pipe and should be 25mm away from it. I don’t the think I’ve heard electric tails being called cold before. What I think you need to do is either contact the previous homeowner if possible or investigate more where the cables run.

Thanks for letting me know that. I just checked, and you're right, I'll fix that today. Really appreciate you pointing that out. When I saw it myself it seemed off, so I'm glad to hear someone else say it. I'll get something between them this afternoon.

 

[flameport]

but finding the cold tails is my problem.

It's one or two cables coming out of the floor adjacent to a wall with further cable(s) to where the controller was.
or more likely, one or two cables in a wall box where the controller/thermostat would have been located.

There should have been another cable for a floor sensor, although that may not have been fitted.

Wall controller usually at the height of a light switch somewhere within the room that has the heating.

is this cutout in the kitchen tile:

That cutout is there so the tile will go flat on the floor, avoiding that crusty old iron pipe end in there. Probably the old gas pipe before the copper one was installed.
Unrelated to any heating.

My problem is that I cannot find where the underfloor heating would actually connect to this junction box..

It doesn't and probably never did.
Even if it was used for that, you would be looking for another similar sized cable from that box to where the wall controller was installed, and that is where the actual heating cable(s) would be.

junction box under the kitchen cabinets

May be unrelated, plenty of kitchen fitter types leave old and new cables randomly in all kinds of places.
Or this underfloor heating was never installed, someone had the idea and labelled up a cable for it, but it was never connected.

In any case, electric UFH is unreliable, expensive and not worth wasting any time or money on.
Even when it works it's a floor tile warmer provided you don't mind waiting for a couple of hours.

 

[Ges1]

Thanks for the in depth response, the junction box had "underfloor heating" taped to the bottom of the kitchen one, too, I just discovered, so it was definitely it, but now I'm thinking they just ripped the tails out at whatever source I now have no hope of finding since I assume it was installed before the cabinets went in.

Appreciate the response, I'll just leave it alone. I want to replace the floor anyway, and yeah, would have preferred a central heating solution in the future anyway so I'll just focus on that

Thanks mate!