Ukraine counter offensive

[IT Minion]

Ukraine anger as Macron says 'Don't humiliate Russia'

The French leader wants to give Vladimir Putin an "exit ramp", but Ukraine rejects that stance.

www.bbc.co.uk

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France's Macron says up to Ukraine to decide on potential territorial concessions

Ukraine alone should decide whether or not to accept any territorial concessions towards Russia in view of ending the war, French President Emmanuel Macron told TF1 television in an interview as he visited Kyiv.

www.reuters.com

seems its nothing more than a political manifesto.

What should they have exported?

Their main exports are Fighter jets, which no one has donated(definitely not EU/US models), and Naval vessels which take a long time to build and longer to train people on.

They have donated their first line artillery units, as have we but in smaller numbers, and I believe there are French Armoured vehicles that are being sent now too.

 

[Pat ex]

Ukraine anger as Macron says 'Don't humiliate Russia'

The French leader wants to give Vladimir Putin an "exit ramp", but Ukraine rejects that stance.

www.bbc.co.uk

Access Restricted

France's Macron says up to Ukraine to decide on potential territorial concessions

Ukraine alone should decide whether or not to accept any territorial concessions towards Russia in view of ending the war, French President Emmanuel Macron told TF1 television in an interview as he visited Kyiv.

www.reuters.com

seems its nothing more than a political manifesto.

Why not quote section of the article, rather than populist headlines?
From your links:

Earlier, Mr Macron told French regional media that Russia's leader had "isolated himself".
"I think, and I told him, that he made a historic and fundamental error for his people, for himself and for history," he said.
"Isolating oneself is one thing, but being able to get out of it is a difficult path," he added.

Ukraine anger as Macron says 'Don't humiliate Russia'

The French leader wants to give Vladimir Putin an "exit ramp", but Ukraine rejects that stance.

www.bbc.co.uk

That seems a sensible attitude. We've seen how Putin has threatened W of M D, as it is. It's seems sensible to not push him towards that.

France is becoming “irrelevant” in the Ukraine war and should do more to bump up its meagre supply of weapons, a top French defence expert has warned.
The country has so far given €233 million in military aid compared

Access Restricted

France does not disclose how much military it gives to Ukraine, so opinions are naturally coloured by prejudice, and are not reliable estimates.

Ukraine alone should decide whether or not to accept any territorial concessions towards Russia in view of ending the war, French President Emmanuel Macron told TF1 television in an interview as he visited Kyiv.

France's Macron says up to Ukraine to decide on potential territorial concessions

Ukraine alone should decide whether or not to accept any territorial concessions towards Russia in view of ending the war, French President Emmanuel Macron told TF1 television in an interview as he visited Kyiv.

www.reuters.com

it seems like you're not reading your own links before posting them.

 

[bernardgreen]

From the BBC

Russian-installed officials in Kherson confirmed the advance, but said Moscow's forces were digging in.

The cynic in me and a German friend think

Russian-installed officials in Kherson confirmed the advance, but said Moscow's forces were digging in a grave situation

 

[ajohn]

it seems like you're not reading your own links before posting them.

The reuters link is more or less what all think - if there are any concessions. Note the if.

 

[Pat ex]

The reuters link is more or less what all think - if there are any concessions. Note the if.

What are you saying?
That motorbiking's link suggests that France's opinion concurs with other western nations?

So, in essence, motorbiking should read the links before posting them, to ensure himself that they convey what he wants then to convey?

 

[ajohn]

That motorbiking's link suggests that France's opinion concurs with other western nations?

In real terms yes as it is up to Ukraine. Rather obvious really isn't it. You though will just take it another way,

 

[Pat ex]

You though will just take it another way,

Don't be silly, I'm fully supportive of Ukraine, and the western world's support of Ukraine.

 

[gant]

By calling him silly it reads to me like you've took it another way.

 

[ajohn]

By calling him silly it reads to me like you've took it another way.

The thing that got me about that particular link is Macron was asked. He gave the obvious reply and it is up to Ukraine to decide.

His other comments. Looking for some other solution with intransigent sides. That one needs to be put into context with what else he said as well. It would be better to hear all of it rather than snippets. Also talking to his own population - what do they feel?

Putin - well he has put himself in a much more solid corner rather recently. Far more than earlier on. The consequences??? Maybe he wont sign the paper work. Maybe he will. Ukraine is obviously going to walk all over him soon? Or is it just that Macron sees some solution other than war to the end would be a better option for both sides? The president of Georgia appeared to have a similar view. Political ructions there now. They see themselves as friendly with Russia and in the EU. According to reports anyway.

 

[Pat ex]

The thing that got me about that particular link is Macron was asked. He gave the obvious reply and it is up to Ukraine to decide.

His other comments. Looking for some other solution with intransigent sides. That one needs to be put into context with what else he said as well. It would be better to hear all of it rather than snippets.

It seems crystal clear to me:

Ukraine's president had repeatedly said his country would not accept giving up any of its territory as a result of Russia's invasion.
"This is up to Ukraine to decide," Macron said when asked what concessions, including on its territory, Ukraine should accept, adding: "I think it is our duty to stand by our values, by international law and thus by Ukraine."

What do you think Biden or Truss would have said, if they were asked?

Clearly, a reporter asked a question, possibly with the express intention of printing Macron's reply.
I don't see any other western leader being asked the same question. Why is that?

 

[IT Minion]

Russia should push on hard and take the whole of ukraine and topple the puppet elensky regime to ensure the americans never have a say in ukraine.
I think once the 300,000 new recruits free up the russian main battle groups then we should see a much harder drive west.
And of course General Winter is joining the battle soon which will no doubt stall the ukranians.
The ukranians certainly under its current leadership don't deserve the territory of the east.
Why is putin holding back? Thats what I can't understand.
At this stage they should be considering strikes on american lng facilities after nordstream.
And a leader who can take a much tougher stance against the west.

They'd get their arses handed to them if they actually went up against NATO. They've struggled against Ukraine using Soviet standard kit and whatever NATO had spare. The US have donated something like 2% of its MRLS vehicles and that's been enough to hamstring Russian logistics.

The last thing Putin wants is to actually fight NATO.

 

[transam]

The losses and humiliation keep getting worse for Putin

Just hours after his his concert in red square in which the fruit cake proclaimed the 4 provinces are Russian territory for ever the Ukraine recaptured Lyman
Luhansk and Kherson

A day later they achieved a break through and were advancing rapidly along the Dnipro river

Reports from BBC people on the ground state that the Russians fled abandoning military equipment such was there haste to get out

Fact is Putin now controls less territory than he did in the first week of his invasion

How ever ( to be continued )

 

[transam]

The question may be is how a very worried / concerned ( cornered?) Putin may react ??

Is the fruit cake willing to risk using tactical battlefield nukes ???

Is he actually able to ??

Last week bidens national security adviser declared that tactical nukes would result in
Catastrophic consequences for Russia

Apparently in private conversations with Russia ??? The US spelled out how the US would react ???

 

[Charlie George]

Russia should push on hard and take the whole of ukraine and topple the puppet elensky regime to ensure the americans never have a say in ukraine.
The job needs to be finished right and I think many russians know that.
I think once the 300,000 new recruits free up the russian main battle groups then we should see a much harder drive west.
And of course General Winter is joining the battle soon which will no doubt stall the ukranians.
The ukranians certainly under its current leadership don't deserve the territory of the east.
Why is putin holding back? Thats what I can't understand.
At this stage they should be considering strikes on american lng facilities after nordstream.
And a leader who can take a much tougher stance against the west.

Ukraine has been defeating the best professional army russia has, why do you think 300,000 vodka fuelled, dressed in rags, with rusty guns, using obsolete 1960s equipment from the scrapyard, with a cold and wet winter coming, and who don't want to be there, are going to fare better, against motivated Ukrainians fighting for their survival?

 

[transam]

Indeed.
At the moment only the poles and a few hawks in washington dc want to go to war with russia.
How long before nato fragments?
A poll has been conducted in germany and many germans now believe the americans were responsible for nordstream.

Russian propaganda bandied around by Putin apologists

Nato is already fragmented ? In private
With out the US it probably does not amount to a bag of beans any way

The Germans