want glossy white internal doors - what's best value paint?

[dalston]

In my new flat there are 5 internal doors I want to paint glossy white. Any advice on method and choice of products will be greatly appreciated.

I have an overall tight budget for my redecoration, and I've got the impression that using high gloss paint can run quite expensive depending on brand and number of coats needed.

The doors are the usual cheap stuff; a few layers of ply each side and presumably a honeycomb structure in the middle. They are hardly worth saving, but getting new doors could become a nightmare as they are all different non standard sizes.
As you can see from the picture they have a wood veneer effect and a liberal coating of dark brown varnish.

My plan so far:

1) Go over surface with sanding machine.
2) One or two coats of primer - can you recommend a primer and a roller?
3) One or two coats of glossy paint (or satin if that is cheaper or simpler).

Of course I could just spend a few minutes on google and buy the cheapest stuff around, but as we all have experienced there is such a thing as false economy. So again, all advice on cost effective primer and paint, as well as method, will be greatly appreciated.

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[bradleydecorating]

If you are on that tight a budget I would recommend you leave the doors as they are, because cheap paint is usually rubbish. If you have 6-8 doors in the property, you are looking at 5 litres of primer/undercoat (approx £35) and 5 litres of gloss or satinwood (£35-50).

If you use high gloss paint at the moment you need to be aware that unless you pay a lot, it may go yellow within about six months. It is also harder to get a professional-looking finish with gloss.

For this reason I'd recommend satinwood or eggshell finish, but if the other woodwork in the property is gloss, it would need re-painting to match, as the mixture of some gloss and some satinwood looks odd.

I recommend either Berger Primer Undercoat followed by Berger non-drip gloss OR satinwood,

OR

Johnstone's Eco Water-based undercoat and Johntone's Acrylic Satinwood (also water-based, no strong smell and non-yellowing).
Berger Primer Undercoat combined

 

[StephenW]

It's easy to gets runs or sags when painting smooth doors so if you can take the door off and lie it flat before painting you'll find you get a better finish.

 

[misterhelpful]

If the doors are nice and smooth and don't require sanding other than to provide a key for the paint then it may be wiser to use something like Zinsser B-I-N to prime them. This will adhere to the surface without sanding but, if the doors are rough and need sanding, it will also stop any resins bleeding through (which can happen with sanded/unvarnished sapele/hardwood doors) if you happen to sand back a bit too far.
If you are on a tight budget then Zinsser may be out because they are by no means the cheapest products but will save time on prep and the basecoat if you use a one coat/self undercoating gloss.

Similar topic here:

//www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=934883#934883

//www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=314930#314930

As said, glosses yellow very quickly now, especially in areas without natural light, so you will need to consider that.

 

[TheDec]

Wet abrade with 400 grit, all you need to achieve is to dull down the sheen, then apply one or if needed two coats of Crown solo.

Dec

 

[coliholic]

Just done 5 doors the same as yours. 120 grit paper on a sanding machine. DULUX white emulsion rollered on as an undercoat (dries quickly) and DULUX white satinwood rollered on as topcoat. Don't EVER use cheap paint. Only Dulux, learned from the mistake. Two days work.

 

[dcdec]

Coliholic thats very bad advice, emulsion is about the worst thing you could have used, also Dulux are going down hill fast, you'll have nice yellow doors in know time at all and a pro would easily do 5 doors in a day with time to spare.

 

[dalston]

Thanks for all responses guys! You're the reason why I rate this forum so highly. Thanks to you I am now firmly converted to WATERBASED and SATIN.
I realise I already have a small can of Zinsser 123 waiting for me to do the windowsills and windowframes. For that same job I bought some Johnstone's waterbased high gloss. Perhaps I should be consistent around my flat and exchange this glossy tin for something satin?

I have found affordable Zinsser 123 on ebay and if my doors only need one coating I guess the 2.5 l for £27 should do?
EDIT: I just called the Zinsser company and they recommend the Shellac Bin product?

What do you think by following up with a Johnstone's satin product? Which one do you recommend? I see a few different products. Is the One Coat Satinwood any decent? http://www.inest.co.uk/products/Johnstone-s_JADJBRI4_One_Coat_Satinwood_Brilliant_White_2-5L.asp
But there is a dearer one. Is it worth the extra money?
http://www.decoratingwarehouse.co.u...ts/johnstones-acrylic-satin--water-based-/816

I notice Crown gets good reports around various internet forms. It seems cheaper than Johnstones. What do you reckon? Again there are a few different products to choose from.

Oh, and how about Dulux Diamond Satinwood? Seems pricey but covers more area I guess? How thin would you mix it?

 

[misterhelpful]

The Zinsser B-I-N is shellac based whereas the BullsEye 1-2-3 is water based so if you go down this route you would be wise to take Zinsser's advice and use the B-I-N.

There is nothing wrong with the Crown Solo (great paint and stays whiter for longer than most other oil based paints nowadays) method suggested by Dec but I would prefer the Zinsser which eliminates the need to sand, and with it, the risk of sanding too far which could allow resin to bleed through. Just my pesonal preference but it's up to you which you choose.

The Johnstones Trade version will be superior to their retail paint and the water based satin will stay white for much longer than oil based products. (That goes for most brands.)

 

[Coaster]

dalston -

Be wary of Dulux!!. If you want to use Dulux, Test paint on a piece of wood then leave for a month or two.

I've painted all the wooden fittings inside the house and it all yellowed horribly in the space of a month! after 6 months it's &*ing hiddeous!!

Dulux tested a paint sample then gave me a voucher for a couple of tins of paint - small recompense since all the work i did, and will have to re-do to fix it all!

The secret of a good finish is preperation.. e.g sandpapering and getting a smooth sound surface. the painting part is just the "finishing it off" stage.

 

[elrobbo82]

you are correct coaster prep is very important.

try using a water based system for your undercoat and gloss stages as these resist yellowing for longer. i have found johnstones aqua range quite good and also crown water based gloss. the only problems with the water based systems is they tend to be harder to eliminate all your brush marks.

i've heard mention on this forum of people being really impressed with the sikens water based systems but i have to admit i have not used these. hopefully some one will post and give advice on these systems.

 

[dcdec]

I've been messing around with WB u/c's and top coats for a while and my conclusions are.

Gloss - The hardest to deal with, things like skirtings and architraves are ok but its the broader areas that are difficult as its impossible to eliminate brush marks. The best i have found so far is Caparol and in the new year i'll be looking at buying a spray system for application.
I can't understand why sikkens dont supply the UK with WB gloss thats available on the continent, is it because it will affect Dulux sales too much?

Undercoat - Sikkens BL absolutely brilliant and cant see the point in trying any others, only down side is it obliterates less well than OB but thats par for the course unfortunately.

Satin - Again Sikkens satura, no point trying anything else

Eggshell - Its not something i use very often but from what i've read little green is recommended

General opinion - I hate the fact that i am forced to change my techniques, habits and products because of this bloody EU bullshit, i have always been able to gloss to a high standard but at the same time realise that the future is very much geared towards water based/hybrid paints. The big upside is drying times, this morning i have undercoated and i'll go back this afternoon to gloss and thats the job finished. Price is a big issue as well, the better WB finishing paints are far to expensive, i feel that we 'pro's are getting very little help from the paint manufacturers, they should at least be offering free 250ml samples.

I really see no point in continuing with oil based as its now on borrowed time, the manufacturers don't seem to be able to come up with a good post 2010 recipe and as i've said before on this forum they don't really have the incentive to 're-invent the video recorder when its been replaced with dvd'.
One final thing i dont understand is the americans have successfully been using WB paint for some time now and yet companies like Brewers seem to have no interest in doing a deal and stocking US paints, if Dulux, Crown etc can't come up with the goods they should be dumped for better, proven successful products.

 

[bradleydecorating]

General opinion - I hate the fact that i am forced to change my techniques, habits and products because of this bloody EU bulls**t,

Actually, I'm quite glad that I will not now be exposed to carcinogenic VOCs for the rest of my working life.

I suspect people had rather the same reaction (as yours) when lead was phased out of paint and petrol... and when they stopped using mercury in millinery (it rotted the brain, hence 'mad as a hatter')...and when the Clean Air Act came in...and when they took Paraquat off general sale...and when they restricted radiographers' exposure to X rays...and protected people from asbestos dust. (Just a few of the measures designed to protect the population from genetic mutations/damage to the central nervous system).

 

[RMS]

the only problems with the water based systems is they tend to be harder to eliminate all your brush marks.

And the fact that a water based finish is not has hard wearing and will age quicker.

Oils based finish paints may eventually yellow (some quicker than others) but a water based finish will probably be scuffed and marked to bits by this time.

 

[elrobbo82]

And the fact that a water based finish is not has hard wearing and will age quicker.

Oils based finish paints may eventually yellow (some quicker than others) but a water based finish will probably be scuffed and marked to bits by this time.

i disagree as it is dependent on what system you apply. if the water based gloss has been applied correctly it will be just as hard wearing as oil based and with the fact that it does not yellow means that it would actually age better.