wiring question

[samohtom]

Quick question on wiring. Is it allowed to run a cable as shown by the red line? Ring main is in pink - the idea is to get a socket outlet on the other side of the room as there aren't any in that bit, and it'd be a lot easier than going all the way around the wall (I'm not sure how safe that would be anyway?!). I presume I'd need to either blank off the existing single socket and join the cables or I guess I could turn it into an accessible FCU for the socket on the other side of the room? Floor is concrete, so it would be chased in (in conduit) and covered with screed.

Untitled

• samohtom
• 3 Jan 2014
• 1

Thanks

Tom

 

[EFLImpudence]

Aren't there any sockets on the other side of the desired position?

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

Can you not go through the ceiling void with the cable?
You would require to bury the cable at least 50mm or mechanically protect it.
Also a requirement for RCD protection.

 

[casamena]

what floor is it concrete?

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

what floor is it concrete?

Floor is concrete, so it would be chased in (in conduit) and covered with screed.

 

[casamena]

no problem get it boomed, if through joists drill hole 50mm bellow top n bottom.
off topic have you used a program for that graphic of your kitchen if so what was it?

 

[sparkwright]

Can you not go through the ceiling void with the cable?
You would require to bury the cable at least 50mm or mechanically protect it.
Also a requirement for RCD protection.

DOES it have to be 50mm deep??

In the wall it could be in a safe zone, and I don't think there's a rule on 50mm for a floor.

 

[casamena]

what floor is it concrete?

Floor is concrete, so it would be chased in (in conduit) and covered with screed.

sorry didn't read through. id get a decent chase and use earthed galvanised conduit

 

[sparkwright]

There's something about DIYers using metal conduit I don't like. I think it's the sharp edges and lack of the correct threading tools.

I can't see why round plastic conduit wouldn't do the job, this was the norm on purpose built flats once.

Also, there are special cables out there that are fairly robust that can go straight in the screed, and are easy to terminate.

 

[samohtom]

Hi again. There is one socket the other side of the door, but that would be even harder to connect to (it'd be a very long spur run up and over the door and ruin the plastering. Ceiling isn't an option as it's been redone and coved. The galvanised conduit seems like a good idea, but 50mm seems a lot to bury it. ? Also, the ring main obviously has RCD protection so is there a requirement to earth the conduit as well or is it ok to just bury the conduit? I'm not sure I'd want to bury it 50mm deep under the bit with the new socket - it's only a party wall so is only 4-5 inches thick masonry as it is. Does the conduit not stop a drill?!

Program is easy planner 3D. I'm still working on the kitchen design, but things would be easier if there was a socket in that corner!

Thanks

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

DOES it have to be 50mm deep??

with regards to omitting RCD protection of the cable, I understand that is what the requirements state.

In the wall it could be in a safe zone, and I don't think there's a rule on 50mm for a floor.

Safe zones don't omit RCD protection 522.6.102.
There is only a requirement concerning wooden/timber joist, but you are required to offer a sensible degree of protection against mechanical impact, and I would consider if 50mm is good enough for timber floors, it is a good benchmark for solid floors.

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

There is one socket the other side of the door, but that would be even harder to connect to (it'd be a very long spur run up and over the door and ruin the plastering. Ceiling isn't an option as it's been redone and coved.

Sometimes you just have break into the fabric of the building, I hope this is not newly done plastering as that sounds like you have not thought this through very well!

The galvanised conduit seems like a good idea, but 50mm seems a lot to bury it. ? Also, the ring main obviously has RCD protection so is there a requirement to earth the conduit as well or is it ok to just bury the conduit? I'm not sure I'd want to bury it 50mm deep under the bit with the new socket - it's only a party wall so is only 4-5 inches thick masonry as it is. Does the conduit not stop a drill?!

Metallic conduit is mechanical protection, if you understood my post then you would there is not requirement to bury this 50mm.
There are also building regs that refer to the maximum depths of chases (part A). You cannot just rip a chase in the wall, you have keep the structure safe.
But if you have 30mA RCD protection that is functioning correctly (this would require special test to confirm) on this circuit. Then the 50mm depth within walls is not required.

 

[sparkwright]

Hi again. There is one socket the other side of the door, but that would be even harder to connect to (it'd be a very long spur run up and over the door and ruin the plastering.

Thanks

From what you desribe, this sounds drastic, also it seems going in the floor is the best solution.

A 'spur' seems a bit minimal. Since the desired new position seems so remote, adding things later could be very difficult...

 

[samohtom]

'Metallic conduit is mechanical protection, if you understood my post then you would there is not requirement to bury this 50mm.
There are also building regs that refer to the maximum depths of chases (part A). You cannot just rip a chase in the wall, you have keep the structure safe.
But if you have 30mA RCD protection that is functioning correctly (this would require special test to confirm) on this circuit. Then the 50mm depth within walls is not required.'

Everything in the flat is RCD protected as all the circuits have an RCD back at the consumer unit - so if I enclose the cable in steel conduit in the wall and floor and bury it (but less than 50mm deep - the conduit is supposed to protect the cable presumably, you only need to bury that deep when you're not protecting it?) that should be enough, yes? And if it's RCD protected, is there a requirement to earth the conduit or is the RCD protection enough? With the RCD protection, the RCD at the consumer unit will be the standard one for a ring main 16A I think - are you saying this outlet would have to have it's own separate RCD rated at 30mA (or one built into the outlet itself)? Could I use something like this:-

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/13A-TWIN-...-30mA-CURRENT-TRIPPING-WRCDSSK2-/300793706785

 

[casamena]

30mA would be enough for a fridge and freezer..

lol sorry that made me chuckle