Wood to attach 2x4 joists on wall

[Richard Cull]

Hi I'm building over the stairwell in my son's room so he has a built in wardrobe, accounting for stair head room etc.

There will be 2x4 joists running across for about 80cm, supporting this, resting on a small stud wall (see attached) to a 2x4 plate plate on the brick wall opposite.

I assume it would be fine to attach these joists to a plate made of the same 2x4? It looks like I should be fine, being a short distance, but best to check others' views!

Thanks in advance

 

[noseall]

Yes. You'd be as well fixing some short galv' angles to the butted edges of the joists rather than try and make bulky jiffys work.

 

[Richard Cull]

Thanks for the info, appreciate that. I was actually wondering how to attach the final joists. I can't use joist hangers as the joist plate itself will extend over the side of the mini floor/platform im making, and that would obviously make it look terrible/not possible to plasterboard over as the plate would stick out.

For the end pieces, I was going to attach by drilling in three 6x100mm countersunk turbo screws, as opposed to using any joist hangers. There won't be any load on these so feel it would be fine.

However, I do read online but to use screws for joists, but hangers and twist nails. That's fine, but it's difficult to find any corner for brace for 2x4 (38x89mm) that would work ie a brace that will only need to be nailed in on the inner side of each outside edge joist.

I hope that makes sense!

 

[Richard Cull]

I saw these. Would they really be better (with twist nails) than attaching with the 6x100mm turbo screws?

https://www.screwfix.com/p/sabrefix...lvanised-60-x-50mm-10-pack/61576#BVQAWidgetID

 

[blup]

Ring shank nails skew nailed into the ledger. Much stronger than screws

Blup

 

[Richard Cull]

Thanks for that. But wouldn't a screw easily split the wood? The 2x4 is only 38mm wide, so likely to do so?

Would the ring shank nails really be stronger than 6x100mm screws? Surely they would hold better? I'm no expert though! These are the screws:

https://www.diy.com/departments/tur...a-6mm-l-100mm-pack-of-20/3663602747437_BQ.prd

 

[mikeey84]

As I understand it nails can withstand shear forces much better than screws, which can snap much more readily than nails

 

[Richard Cull]

Yeah I have heard that too. I think the options are to:

1) Use ring shank nails to butt joint the ledger to the joists

2) Use three 6x100mm screws instead

3) Or use a heavy duty corner bracket and use joist twist nails to secure in (have loads of those already). This is the bracket I'm thinking of:
https://www.screwfix.com/p/sabrefix...s4SFHfEwyZTNiH4X2PwaAqPvEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

Any thoughts on that would be great.

Thanks

 

[big-all]

keep in mind you need 2m head clearance from the nose line off the stairs
if you turn the last joist flat that will give you an extra couple off inches off depth whilst maintaining head clearance

 

[Richard Cull]

Hi yeah head clearance is well considered. I've checked it through and through, so all good on that front.

What's your view on the post above yours? I'm swaying towards putting the end joist in using a heavy duty corner bracket on the inside of the joist, with twist nails.

 

[big-all]

the last one i done i just made up a ladder frame and screw and or plugged it both sides
after all it is a static load no more than 2 daft kids playing

 

[blup]

1) Use ring shank nails to butt joint the ledger to the joists

I assumed you would be sitting the joist on the ledger.

Blup

 

[noseall]

I assumed you would be sitting the joist on the ledger.

Blup

That might look odd if he plasterboards the underside of the 2" x 4"...

 

[blup]

Not as odd maybe as the OP’s son falling through the ceiling (God forbid) when an inherently weak butt joint fails. He has to assume the kid and his mates will use it as a den or suchlike.

Blup

 

[noseall]

Not as odd maybe as the OP’s son falling through the ceiling (God forbid) when an inherently weak butt joint fails.

err..

Yes. You'd be as well fixing some short galv' angles to the butted edges of the joists rather than try and make bulky jiffys work.