Hi Check out my home project

craigf · 11 Jan 2004

just thought I would share with you all my new project at home. I will be enclosing below our conservatory thus creating a new room which will lead through to the laundry room in the new basement.

Access will be down a space saving spiral staircase from above. check out the picture its the start of things to come.

Pal · 12 Jan 2004

Are you serious?

Good luck with this mate from a fellow newbie with a huge project currently under construction.

Keep us posted with photos.

Pal

craigf · 13 Jan 2004

thanks Pal
13.01.2004
Just to let you know all is well with the work. as of today this is how the work lies.
1 Both side walls have now had the footings dug out
2 Both side walls have had the dwarf walls built
3 Both side walls have got the studwork in place on top of dpc
4 Both side walls are covered outside with 1/2" wbp ex grade ply and sealed with mastic

I will be cladding the outside walls with shiplap and inside the studwork will be filled with 80mm insulation the covered with plastic prior to the wall board being fitted.

The 2 front walls are now built up to the required height with air bricks fitted to allow air circulation under the floor. They are now ready to except the hardwood french doors and the hardwood window panes.
The floor level is set and half the joists are in place, this will be filled with block insulation then covered with 3/4" wbp ex grade ply. electric underfloor heating will go over this before the top cover of some kind of wood flooring(not sure what type)

Pal · 16 Jan 2004

I'm interested to read how you dealt with the floor, you mention half the joist are in place. I guess you have had to raise the floor up. Are the joist suspended or supported? What size are the timbers, what size/span is the room etc.

Thanks.

Pal

craigf · 16 Jan 2004

Pal the joists are now all done 6"x2" timbers, the room is 16'x10'. I raw bolted joists on a level all around the 4 walls, I then used joist hangers to hang the joists @400 centres. span = 10', The air bricks that I fitted into the front walls will allow air to circulate under the floor. I then ran 3 lines of noggins and covered it all in 3/4 ply with no bounce at all. 60mm board insulation is fitted in between the joists.
I had to raise the floor upto the front and side wall levels that I had set.
16.01.2004
Today I have fitted the hardwood french door frame and fitted side panels span = 7'6" and also hardwood window frame span = 6'4". this will have 3 panels of double glazed toughned glass.
Saturday I shall be fitting the sides wide shiplap and all being well I shall get time to hang the french doors and treat them.

Pal · 16 Jan 2004

Cheers craigf,

This was my chosen method of installing the floor but others ideas have been floated around and put doubt in my mind.

I'm spanning 8 foot and thought 5x2's at 400mm would give me the strength I need. I say 5's because if I use these around the edge they will be well clear of the DPC. What would be the problem with using 5's around the edge but hanging 6's off them?

I'm guessing min 4 inch coachscrews into Fischer wall plugs should do it but what do you reckon is good centres for the fixings for a good solid fixing and did you just fix through the centre of the timber or above and below it?

Are building control happy with this method?

Sorry about all the questions but if I can get this info together I will be ready to go for it.

Cheers.

Pal

Pal · 22 Jan 2004

Craigf,

How's it going

Pal

masona · 22 Jan 2004

Pal said:
This was my chosen method of installing the floor but others ideas have been floated around and put doubt in my mind.

The problem I find with side wallplate and wall hanger is,you're putting a lot of strains on the rawbolts taking the whole weight of the floor + furniture and any movement the floor will tend to give you a springy action.
You'll better off with a single 3 sleeper wall + wallplate for joists to rest on for a trouble free solid floor.And don't forget air-vent brick.

Pal · 22 Jan 2004

Thanks again Masona,

I know you gave this advice in my project but seeing/hearing someone actually doing by bolting wall plates around the edge and not getting any bounce makes me think this is the way forward.

I know you recommend/favour sleeper walls and I can see you point from a loading/movement point of view, please can you tell me where I am going wrong/fill in the gaps bearing in mind I only need to raise my floor by just over 9 inches. Perhaps you can give me the 'idiots guide to sleeper wall/floor construction'.

1.Bed a single row of bricks on mortar (approx 3" high) leaving half brick gaps between for air flow. Air bricks have been put in. I guess three walls down the 16 foot length, one in the middle and the other two about a foot from each wall???
2.Bed a strip of DPC on top on mortar. ( this will solve my earlier question about sealing the floor)
3.Set 4x2 treated timber on top (2" high). NOT SURE HOW THIS IS DONE, IS IS JUST BEDDED ON MORTAR? i.e. No physical fixing?
4.Set 4x2 treated joists (4" high bringing me to the required approx 9") across width of room (8 foot) at 400mm centres. THIS IS WHERE I AM LACKING INFO, DO YOU JUST NOGGIN BETWEEN THEM IN TWO OR THREE PLACES TO BRING IT TOGETHER AS ONE STRUCTURE???? WOODEN OFFCUT 4x2 NOGGINS OR METAL PRE MANUFACTUmanufacturedsulation.
6.18mm water resistant boards.
7.JOB DONE!!!!!

Thanks in advance for your help.

Pal

craigf · 22 Jan 2004

How's it going

Well Pal here goes, the building inspecter came on Monday and blow me all is well, he's a happy chappy at last. He wants to come back when the glass units are in just to check the they are what I say they are.
Pal the floor and insulation is all complete, the side walls are also insulated and covered with a vapour barrier.
The french doors are all hung and the other opening has now got all double glazed units fitted.
All I have to do now is construct a canopy over the front elevation out of timber and cover it with lead.
Then coat the timber walls outside and seal with mastic. Electrics and internal floor finsh and dry lining will be done very soon after the cast iron spiral staircase has been fitted, I will need help with this as it is very heavy, I have some more photos that I will post for you very soon. thanks for your interest.

Pal · 22 Jan 2004

Craigf,

Always good to hear the Building Inspector is happy.

I am hoping for some further info from Masona but are you able to give me any info about the fixing, see my post 16.1.04 9.40pm

Cheers.

Pal

masona · 22 Jan 2004

Pal,
What you do is to break off the brick approx half way all round to the bottom of the frog level (frog is the hole in the brick) so that should give you approx 40mm brick thickness ( you can get 40mm thickness brickwork using engineer block paving )

As below starting from top floor level.

18mm flooring

100mmx50mm (on side) joists screw to the side onto the wall plate when wallplate fully dry and solid.No more than 400mm centres.

100mmx50mm (on flat with dpc and non-rust flat head nailed on underneath to hold it in place) then bedded onto the cement,tap it gently until level and right height

10mm cement

40mm brickwork (1 course and no need for air gap in brickwork as this will be achieve over the wallplate etc

10mm cement on oversite base.

Total 228mm = 9"

No need to put noggin anywhere but make sure the timber not touching on any walls plus good ventilation.
See drawing

As always,check with your building control inspector who may have a difference idea.

Pal · 23 Jan 2004

Cheers Masona,

Thanks for this, I think I have it clear in my mind and agree it sounds easier than having to fix numerous coach screws all the way around the room. Just a few supplementary questions:-

1.DPC – I am still a little bit confused where this actually sits. Are you saying to nail the dpc to the underside of the wall plates with non-rust flat head nails before bedding the plates onto the 10mm cement? I do not fully understand the issues surrounding damp but wouldn’t this affect the integrity of the dpc?

2.I note the ends of the wall plates and the joists should not touch the walls but how close should it go?

3.Finally, what distance away from the walls would you recommend the sleeper walls which run down the length of the room? Your drawing give the impression it should be about 9 inches or so.

I will be putting some insulation between the joists so airflow over the wall plate may become an issue. That being so I presume there would be no reason why I can not leave gaps between the brickwork.

Once I have the knowledge I will of course seek agreement to my plans with the inspector before commencement.

Best wishes,

Pal

masona · 23 Jan 2004

Pal said:
1.DPC – I am still a little bit confused where this actually sits. Are you saying to nail the dpc to the underside of the wall plates with non-rust flat head nails before bedding the plates onto the 10mm cement? I do not fully understand the issues surrounding damp but wouldn’t this affect the integrity of the dpc?

Yes,you're right normally as follow:
ground level>cement>brick>cement>dpc>cement>4"x2" wallplate.The problem is you haven't got a lot of room to put the dpc in between cement.My building inspector was happy that I've pinned it onto the 4"x2" wallplate and I used a stable gun (again non-rust,copper stable and cover it with sealant) instead of nail,so you now have cement>brick>cement>dpc+wallplate.I suppose there's nothing to stop using bitumen coat instead of dpc,check with the building inspector.In the olden days nothing was ever use for protection of the timber!

2.I note the ends of the wall plates and the joists should not touch the walls but how close should it go?

Approx 15mm to 20mm and always put the floor joists not wallplate the shortest span,more solid this way and stronger.

3.Finally, what distance away from the walls would you recommend the sleeper walls which run down the length of the room? Your drawing give the impression it should be about 9 inches or so

150mm from the wall will be okay.

I will be putting some insulation between the joists so airflow over the wall plate may become an issue. That being so I presume there would be no reason why I can not leave gaps between the brickwork

If I were you,I would stop the insulation approx 100mm on both side of the wallplate as you could find the gaps between the brick become blocked + the walls would be stronger if it all in one course.

Pal · 23 Jan 2004

I am grateful.

I will carefully check the height I need to raise because I think I do have at least an extra 10mm or so and guess I just bed the dpc between two layers of mortar before the wall plate is sat on top.

What keeps the wall plate in place/how is it bonded to the mortar?

Cheers.

Not sure if admin for this site want to move this and the last three or four messages to most original post, I am mindful we are hijacking that of Craigf.

Pal

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