Frost light

[rkinsella]

Hi all,

During the severe frost last winter many of the houses in the estate that I live in where destroyed by burst pipes in the attic. Timber frames house just seem to get completely destroyed by a flood. My dad keeps talking about me "getting a frost light" in the attic, I can't seem to find them for sale anywhere. 

I think the general idea is that it is a light that comes on when the temperature drops below a given threshold and heat produced by the light is enough to keep the pipes from freezing. Can anyone point me in the right direction to get one? 

(The pipes are already insulated  )

Thanks

Ray Kinsella

 

[TicklyT]

I would be looking more to how pipes etc. have been run through the loft space. If they are enclosed within the loft insulation, they should be kept above freezing by heat rising through the ceiling below them.

If they are run through the loft in the cold space above the insulation, there's a pretty good chance they will freeze. Lagging the pipes only delays the process.

Same with water tanks - extend the loft insulation up the sides and over the top of the tank, but leave the ceiling directly below the tank uninsulated, and there will be sufficient heat to stop the tank freezing.

Basically it's extending the insulated and heated envelope that's the habitable part of the house to enclose anything in the loft that's likely to freeze.

As for the 'frost light' idea, a frost 'stat, or an ordinary room thermostat set to about 5 degrees would do the job of switching a light on,
but whether a light bulb will give enough heat to keep the frost at bay is another matter, bearing in mind you are attempting to heat an uninsulated and well ventilated space, and 100 Watt tungsten lamps have now been replaced with energy efficient ones that don't get so hot.

It may have appeared to work in older properties not insulated to such high standards, as the loft space would have been warmer anyway, maybe not getting cold enough to freeze pipes, even without a 'frost lamp'

 

[londonboy]

How about using trace pipe heating?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

During the severe frost last winter many of the houses in the estate that I live in where destroyed by burst pipes in the attic.

Are the houses as built, or has extra insulation been added?

Sounds like either the builder or the insulation installers is liable.

 

[AndyPRK]

One way is to get a frost stat fitted in the loft, which turns the heating on (overriding the timer)


In practice whether modern loft insulation prevents the heat rising into the loft I don't know. But at least it will keep a lot of the house warm

 

[RF Lighting]

Get a tubular heater with a frost stat fitted next to the pipework

 

[electronicsuk]

+1 for frost stat in the loft controlling the boiler, as that way, you're not attempting to heat the whole loft just to avoid the pipes freezing. You can prevent the heating running constantly in cold weather by also installing a high limit pipe stat, such that when the pipes reach say 30 degrees, the boiler will switch off again.

 

[ericmark]

I have a role of trace heating and yes it does work. There are two basic types. The cheap stuff comes as a set length with a thermostat at one end and it all needs wrapping on the pipe or it will over heat.
The second "Raychem" is a special compound which changes resistance with heat and can be cut to length with correct termination.
The first type also has a version where each approx 3 meters has a heater and it can be cut to length in multiples of 3 meters.
Earthing is very important and really it is not a DIY job.
I would never consider trace heating in a normal house.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

+1 for frost stat in the loft controlling the boiler, as that way, you're not attempting to heat the whole loft just to avoid the pipes freezing. You can prevent the heating running constantly in cold weather by also installing a high limit pipe stat, such that when the pipes reach say 30 degrees, the boiler will switch off again.

Surely during that last severe winter the heating would have been running a lot of the time anyway?

And how would running the boiler help with non CH pipes? If the loft insulation is doing its job no heat is going to get from the house into the loft, and you're not going to get much heat transferred from a lagged CH pipe to a lagged non-CH pipe. That's assuming there are any CH pipes in the loft in the first place.

Heating the loft would be crazy, trace heating on the pipes less so, but still a bit daft. Just reroute pipes and/or relocate insulation so that the pipes are on the warm side, not the cold.

 

[1john]

I am assuming you have a gravity fed central heating system and a copper cylinder for hot water, which means you have got two tanks in the loft, a feed and expansion tank for the water and another for the heating system, in which case I should imagine that the cold main feeding these tanks is the troublesome one that will freeze. The best way around this is to insulate around the tank with the feed pipe included withing the envelope of insulation, with the heating and hot water on, the temp of the water in these tanks should a fair bit higher than the temp of the cold feed and therefore this should keep the pipe from freezing.

Failing that, consider having a combi installed, or an unvented cylinder and an unvented central heating system. there are pros and cons but you will have no need for any pipework or water tanks in your loft and you get hot water at mains pressure (ish)