Do I understand you correctly? I can build the left side, the dining room, under PD and then add to it? So I could build 3 metres deep from the border? If so how close to the border before I could step it out to 3.5 metres or should I take it from the 45' angle as you mentioned?
Planning Permission Non-determination PART2
- Thread starter pred
- Start date
Do I understand you correctly? I can build the left side, the dining room, under PD and then add to it? So I could build 3 metres deep from the border? If so how close to the border before I could step it out to 3.5 metres or should I take it from the 45' angle as you mentioned?
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That neighbour should not have windows on the boundary. That's a fire risk straightaway.
A planner may be a bit unrealistic in refusing permission, if so what you can do perfectly lawfully, is construct a single or cavity wall on your side of the boundary 1.8m high without any planning permission. That would block those windows. Then add the rest of the extension to it.
The planner will know this, but it may not be enough to persuade then to be practical. Which would mean that you would withdraw the application and then do your enabling work (build the wall). Then reapply.
Generally what you will need to do is determine what are the contentious parts, and then see if you can build those under permitted development or even without it, and only apply for permission for the non contentious parts.
If building under PD the 45° rule won't apply.
The above is an option to get something that would not otherwise be allowed if applying for planning permission. But it may require some of it to be built first. This should not be the case, but some planners seen to think it is, and you need to be assertive with them to help them understand.
A planner may be a bit unrealistic in refusing permission, if so what you can do perfectly lawfully, is construct a single or cavity wall on your side of the boundary 1.8m high without any planning permission. That would block those windows. Then add the rest of the extension to it.
The planner will know this, but it may not be enough to persuade then to be practical. Which would mean that you would withdraw the application and then do your enabling work (build the wall). Then reapply.
Generally what you will need to do is determine what are the contentious parts, and then see if you can build those under permitted development or even without it, and only apply for permission for the non contentious parts.
If building under PD the 45° rule won't apply.
The above is an option to get something that would not otherwise be allowed if applying for planning permission. But it may require some of it to be built first. This should not be the case, but some planners seen to think it is, and you need to be assertive with them to help them understand.
I sent the case officer another email this morning trying to get things moving but she hasn't replied,,,,,,, again!!
Do I have to apply for PD?
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The idea off PD is that you can do certain work without bothering the council. There is a Technical Guide which details the criteria.
However there is also an option to apply to the council for them to confirm what you think is PD actually is - Certificate of Lawful Development.
What I normally do is clearly mark on the drawings what is existing, what is gong to be built as PD and what is being applied for. But you really need to be sure that you ate correct and ready to defend your assertions. Otherwise it's a risk.
You probably need to phone and keep phoning until you get a response. The planner will have a line manager.
However there is also an option to apply to the council for them to confirm what you think is PD actually is - Certificate of Lawful Development.
What I normally do is clearly mark on the drawings what is existing, what is gong to be built as PD and what is being applied for. But you really need to be sure that you ate correct and ready to defend your assertions. Otherwise it's a risk.
You probably need to phone and keep phoning until you get a response. The planner will have a line manager.
Thanks Woody, your comments have been really useful, i looked at the PD online and can see what you mean, before your last comment I thought I would stick the planning application in for the kitchen and then just add the other bit.
So if I do as you suggest I will keep the kitchen at 3,500mm and the dining room at 3,000mm, could you tell me how far back from the border i can increase up to 3,500mm please, I read somewhere 900mm but would the 45' angle come into force?
So if I do as you suggest I will keep the kitchen at 3,500mm and the dining room at 3,000mm, could you tell me how far back from the border i can increase up to 3,500mm please, I read somewhere 900mm but would the 45' angle come into force?
You can build up to the boundary. But you need to allow for any roof overhang, so step the wall in according to the soffit and gutter width unless there is no overhang (internal gutter or parapet). Allow 150mm for a half-round gutter and plastic fascia on a timber backing board
You need to accurately measure where the neighbour's patio door is and mark out the 45° line on your plan. But if you are doing this part under PD, then you don't have to worry about the 45° line.
You need to be clear though about what can and can't be done under PD, and what you may need to apply for planning permission for. Speak with the planner first. If she is definitely not going to approve your application and you can't agree a compromise, then unless you don't agree and are minded to appeal a refusal, then its best to withdraw the application and submit a revised plan - it will be at no cost.
You need to accurately measure where the neighbour's patio door is and mark out the 45° line on your plan. But if you are doing this part under PD, then you don't have to worry about the 45° line.
You need to be clear though about what can and can't be done under PD, and what you may need to apply for planning permission for. Speak with the planner first. If she is definitely not going to approve your application and you can't agree a compromise, then unless you don't agree and are minded to appeal a refusal, then its best to withdraw the application and submit a revised plan - it will be at no cost.
Still waiting and getting annoyed! I'm just about to send this email off to the line manager, any thoughts please;
I submitted planning application Ref PP-067455v1 on 14/02/18. My case officer is Sophie Clark. Our initial meeting didn't get off to a good start as we arranged a site visit which she forgot about. When she finally arrived approx an hour late (after my phone call), although she apologised, it did not install me with confidence.
She raised a few minor concerns but assured me that we could work together and resolve these issues. Since her visit, I've phoned numerous times and left a voice mail along with sending two emails, however, I've not received any response from her. As the decision date was the17th April last week, I am concerned that I have not received any information re my application and am still waiting for a reply to my emails and phone calls. Is she off work at present?
I feel my application is obviously trivial to the planning department, however, I can assure you that is it not to me, and I am finding this whole situation very disappointing and unprofessional.
I look forward to receiving a response soon regarding my application.
Thankyou,
I submitted planning application Ref PP-067455v1 on 14/02/18. My case officer is Sophie Clark. Our initial meeting didn't get off to a good start as we arranged a site visit which she forgot about. When she finally arrived approx an hour late (after my phone call), although she apologised, it did not install me with confidence.
She raised a few minor concerns but assured me that we could work together and resolve these issues. Since her visit, I've phoned numerous times and left a voice mail along with sending two emails, however, I've not received any response from her. As the decision date was the17th April last week, I am concerned that I have not received any information re my application and am still waiting for a reply to my emails and phone calls. Is she off work at present?
I feel my application is obviously trivial to the planning department, however, I can assure you that is it not to me, and I am finding this whole situation very disappointing and unprofessional.
I look forward to receiving a response soon regarding my application.
Thankyou,
Sadly the delays and incompetence from the Planners is not that uncommon these days, especially amongst the ones who work on small domestic extension jobs. Most seem to be straight out of college and are constantly referring to their line manager (who is usually on holiday or off sick or both).
If you complain they will probably just close ranks and you can pretty much guarantee a rejection. Usually with these silly queries if you put forward a strong argument and stick to your guns (possibly offer a very minor compromise) they will back down but you have to be patient. As others have said there are counter arguments for the points raised by the planner.
If you complain they will probably just close ranks and you can pretty much guarantee a rejection. Usually with these silly queries if you put forward a strong argument and stick to your guns (possibly offer a very minor compromise) they will back down but you have to be patient. As others have said there are counter arguments for the points raised by the planner.
You don't get a refund if you withdraw the application.
I think your expectations are rather unrealistic. In post #19 you say you sent a planner an email this morning and they haven't replied....were you honestly expecting an instant response? This is the public sector we are talking about, a reply within a fortnight would be a bloody miracle.
I think your expectations are rather unrealistic. In post #19 you say you sent a planner an email this morning and they haven't replied....were you honestly expecting an instant response? This is the public sector we are talking about, a reply within a fortnight would be a bloody miracle.
I would also pipe down on the complaining and negative fronts and focus on getting results, no good ever came of complaining about a domestic app before the decision. You need a tenacious thick skin to deal with planners.
It was six days ago my last email Wessex, also I sent the email off five minutes ago and have now received a reply from her line manager who is sincerely sorry for the delay due to Sophie being out sick, she has assured me that she is on the case and does not take my application as being trivial, I am thick skinned but when they don't reply what are my options?
The deadline was last week, if this is going nowhere i shall ask for my money back and start building under PD
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