Toilet flush problem

[rubble2]

We moved into our house in December and noticed a problem with the main bathroom lavatory straight away, what with other priorities related to the house move, Christmas etc. have only just turned my attention to this to try and find a solution.

Symptoms are :- water level in toilet pan is low a lot of the time, when the toilet is flushed the water level drops even further before refilling the pan and is (50% of the time) accompanied by a 'sucking' noise as the pan empties. ( have to say the toilet has never actually failed to empty at any time).

Research on line suggested that the problem was likely to a blockage somewhere in the drain outside so I finally summoned up the courage today to open up the inspection cover in the garden and found no sign of a blockage. Looking at the soil stack, the bath and washbasin outlets connect to the soil stack just below where the toilet connects - there is no problem with the water flow from the bath or washbasin. While the inspection chamber was uncovered I filled the bath and then pulled the plug and watched the water flow into the inspection chamber and everything seems fine.

So, given the above, does this focus the attention back to the soil pipe between the toilet pan and the soil stack? and if so, would it be advisable to try plunging the toilet pan?

One further thing which may be relevant, when you start to pee into the toilet pan you can hear water beginning to trickle as the level in the pan rises, I have checked and it is not water running into the cistern so it must be the increased water level in the pan running down the soil stack.

Appreciate any advise. Thanks

 

[oldbutnotdead]

All sounds fairly normal. Does the soil stack have a vent at the top of it & is it clear or is there an air admittance valve somewhere in the bathroom- if there is, might be worth making sure it is actually working (if the place was empty for a while before you moved in it might be gunged up).
If the pan is draining normally then wouldn't bother plunging it, tbh it sounds like an American or continental loo (they all seem to have low water level in the bottom & the flush sucks the water level even further down with sound effects).
And yeah water running out of the loo as you fill it up is normal as well.....gravity obviously functioning at your place

 

[JohnD]

water level in toilet pan is low a lot of the time, when the toilet is flushed the water level drops even further before refilling the pan and is (50% of the time) accompanied by a 'sucking' noise as the pan empties.

How old is the WC?

A photo might be informative. include one sideways-on to show the shape of the trap.

One like this can be worth a lot.

 

[rubble2]

Thanks for the replies.

The WC has Twyford on the cistern so I am assuming British manufacture It is probably the original toilet from when the house was built so about 15 years old. To be honest it is on the list of things to be changed so if as it seems there is no underlying problem I will probably just keep using it as it is until it gets swapped.

The soil stack extends to above gutter level and has a cage like fitting at the top, I am guessing that this is not an air admittance valve. As I say, if the consensus is that there are no major issues then I will do nothing and just replace it as and when.

 

[JohnD]

please let us have a photo

if it happens to be a Twyfords Syphonic it will fetch more than your new one costs.

 

[just pumps]

please let us have a photo

if it happens to be a Twyfords Syphonic it will fetch more than your new one costs.

And is still easy to repair.

 

[rubble2]

Never thought I would be posting pictures of my toilet pan on the internet but here goes.

 

[JohnD]

I can't see the trap well enough to tell. Can anyone else?

you really need to kneel down and photo the side

original cistern and lid look uncracked, and it's not aubergine or other unpopular colour.

 

[just pumps]

From what I`m seeing it doesn`t look like a syphonic pan. Hate to say it but whenever I see a box of that size behind a pan I think "macerator" and the op mentioned a sucking noise? I`m guessing here but as the op said the pipes from basin & bath connect to the stack below the toilet I guess this is visable from outside?

 

[rubble2]

This is the best I can get. If it is worth something I could be really in the money because we have exactly the same setup in the downstairs cloakroom

 

[just pumps]

This is the best I can get. If it is worth something I could be really in the money because we have exactly the same setup in the downstairs cloakroom

Bog standard pan.

 

[JohnD]

never mind, I bet it still flushes better than any modern one.

 

[rubble2]

Ok, thanks. Out of curiosity why are syphonic pans valuable and how much are they worth?

 

[JohnD]

they are supremely effective and quiet at sucking the detritus away.

I bought one for my first house, it cost more than the rest of the bathroom suite. Mine had a wide water pool (I don't know if they all did) meaning no detritus soiling the sides of the pan.

I don't see a used pan on ebay today, but there is a used cistern at £75 and a new replica cistern at £175.

I have one I am holding in reserve as a spare

 

[just pumps]

Ok, thanks. Out of curiosity why are syphonic pans valuable and how much are they worth?

The way they worked cleared everything first flush, a lot of plumbers don`t know how they work so they are replaced rather than repaired then people buy a new home and want bathrooms refurbished with modern fittings, at the end of the day those in the know will keep them.