fitting ladder brackets

[bikeit]

Need to fit two metal brackets to a wall to carry a double set of ladders which weigh 15kgs and are 3.5M in length, what fixings would you recommend?

 

[Deleted member 174758]

7mm holes, brown 7mm plugs, 6.0 x 80 to 6.0 x 100mm screws

 

[foxhole]

Need to fit two metal brackets to a wall to carry a double set of ladders which weigh 15kgs and are 3.5M in length, what fixings would you recommend?

Do you have ladder brackets?
What is the wall construction?

 

[Captain Nemesis]

7mm holes, brown 7mm plugs, 6.0 x 80 to 6.0 x 100mm screws

Even allowing for the thickness of the brackets Ive never seen brown wall plugs anywhere near long enough to take 80mm/100mm screws.

You can get longer plugs, quite possibly 100mm ones, but probably not also in such a relatively small diameter.

We await news of how the wall is built, but I doubt that more than 6x50mm screws would be needed for a bracket supporting 7.5Kg.

If there is doubt over the wall then 1 or 2 more brackets might be a better solution than larger or fancier fixings.

 

[Deleted member 174758]

Even allowing for the thickness of the brackets Ive never seen brown wall plugs anywhere near long enough to take 80mm/100mm screws.

The plug provides pull out resistance and allows you to hard fix an item by pulling it furmly onto the surface of the wall. You aim for a snug fitting plug at about 1/4 to 3/4 of the depth of the hole. The length of the screw ensures that if the screw drops it will, by default, wedge itself in the hole, this resisting further pull-out. In a situation like this you need to aim to over engineer the screw rather than make it just big enough simply because it as the ladder is loaded and unloaded there will be a tendency to pull it outwards. You don't normally use more than a single plug per screw because it simply isn't necessary, the exception being where you are dealing with ropey masonry where additional techniques such as drilling 6.5mm holes (instead of 7mm) and adding 2nd or even (in rare instances) 3rd plugs down the hole - although should you need to do much of that you need to start looking at alternative fixing methods such as "thunderbolts" (concrete screws) or resin anchors.

If the wall is thinner than 80mm (maybe single skin brick) then you'd still need to aim for the longest screw you could.

If the wall is timber framed, I would hope the OP would understand the need for the a longer wood screw rather than a short one, and in that case you wouldn't need the plug. It's that simple

BTW 6 x 100 screws aren"t a "larger, fancier fixing" - they are commonly used in structural work, sign box installation and the like and are generally an over the counter size in an ironmonger timber merchants

 

[Captain Nemesis]

The plug provides pull out resistance and allows you to hard fix an item by pulling it furmly onto the surface of the wall.

I know.

You aim for a snug fitting plug at about 1/4 to 3/4 of the depth of the hole.

Well, all I can say is that I have never, ever, seen this recommended:

Nor ever encountered wall plugs without a lip designed to stop you driving them in deeper than flush. Obviously with a drift you can drive them in, but they are designed to not have that done to them.

The length of the screw ensures that if the screw drops it will, by default, wedge itself in the hole, this resisting further pull-out. In a situation like this you need to aim to over engineer the screw rather than make it just big enough simply because it as the ladder is loaded and unloaded there will be a tendency to pull it outwards.

Some of the loading will be shear, and lets not forget that the brackets will have at least two mounting points.

And if you dont have half of the screw with nothing but air around it its a lot less likely to drop.

You don't normally use more than a single plug per screw because it simply isn't necessary,

I didnt suggest using more than one plug per screw. I said that brown wall plugs are not long enough to take 80/100mm screws.

This will be fine, subject to confirmation that the wall isnt ropey

If the wall is thinner than 80mm (maybe single skin brick) then you'd still need to aim for the longest screw you could.

Fine, but I see no point in only having half, or less, of the screw in the plug, and the rest of it in thin air. Once the screw is all the way through the plug, and the plug is fully expanded, the threads in thin air are going to do zilch.

BTW 6 x 100 screws aren"t a "larger, fancier fixing" - they are commonly used in structural work, sign box installation and the like and are generally an over the counter size in an ironmonger timber merchants

I wasnt talking about the screws.

I was talking about 80/100mm long plugs.

 

[bikeit]

Guys the wall is built of concrete blocks which are 8" thick and outside, the ladders weigh 15kgs.

 

[foxhole]

Standard plugs and 70-80 mm screws will be fine .