Hot Tub Isolator location

[rossyl]

Hi

From reading around, I understand that the recommendation is for an isolator to be 2m away, this is to avoid someone in the tub being able to access the isolator.

See photo. Circled is where the 32AMP supply comes to.
This is also the exact spot we want to put the hot tub.

Grateful for recommendations of where we can put the isolator. Can it stay there, is the 2m figure just a recommendation, rather than a rule. If it it below the height of the tub, with a 20cm gap and an IP67 rated isolator.

Thanks

 

[flameport]

2m is the requirement from Section 702 in BS7671, and excludes switchgear and junction boxes from that 2m distance around the tub.
Even without that, you can't locate anything where that box currently is with the tub up against it, as there will be insufficient access to it.

The light currently on the other wall is also a problem, as are those further away as they appear to be less than 2m distance.
Then there is the rope light affair towards the lower left corner of the photo.
There may be other problems and considerations that are not possible to determine from the photo.

 

[rossyl]

2m is the requirement from Section 702 in BS7671, and excludes switchgear and junction boxes from that 2m distance around the tub.
Even without that, you can't locate anything where that box currently is with the tub up against it, as there will be insufficient access to it.

The light currently on the other wall is also a problem, as are those further away as they appear to be less than 2m distance.
Then there is the rope light affair towards the lower left corner of the photo.
There may be other problems and considerations that are not possible to determine from the photo.

Thank you.

If the regs exclude Switch Gear and Junction Boxes.
- Can the isolator be located above that?

Or can I leave the junction box where it is, run cable externally, and locate the isolator a few metres away?

The wall light can be moved or just capped off, as necessary. The rope light is a non-fixed temporary decoration.

Just concerned about the junction box and isolator.

Thanks

 

[flameport]

Excludes means you can't have them there. Within 2m of the edge of the tub, no switchgear, no junction boxes, no lighting fixtures.
If it's connected to 230V AC, then it must be at least 2m from the tub horizontally, and at least 2.5m vertically.

There is also the question of how you expect to be able to open the cover of the tub if it's against a wall on 2 sides.

The reality is that the tub needs to go somewhere else.

 

[rossyl]

The cover is fine. The hot tub fits fine.

The other option is I could run a new supply if I needed to. But, I find life a more fulfilling experience when I look at what's there and come up either with a solution, or with options, rather than deal in absolutes and have a 'computer says no' approach.

 

[rossyl]

Admittedly, I'm not sure if these can be used in a 'near a hot tub' zone 1.

But given these exist for hazardous areas, maybe there is a way to have a junction box in Zone 1? Would that not be a higher test.

So is there a reason I couldn't use one of these?

https://www.cef.co.uk/catalogue/categories/atex-hazardous-area-zone-1-2-junction-boxes

 

[trojanhawrs]

Admittedly, I'm not sure why these exist, if they are not allowed. But given that they do, presumably there is a way to have a junction box in Zone 1.

So is there a reason I couldn't use one of these?

https://www.cef.co.uk/catalogue/categories/atex-hazardous-area-zone-1-2-junction-boxes

These are explosion rated boxes for electrical equipment in hazardous areas to ensure sparks don't ignite the atmosphere. Zone 1 is an area where an explosive gas concentration is relatively likely

 

[rossyl]

These are explosion rated boxes for electrical equipment in hazardous areas to ensure sparks don't ignite the atmosphere. Zone 1 is an area where an explosive gas concentration is relatively likely

That was quick! I was just amending what I wrote as I was thinking it over

Is there any crossover at all, so that something like this would be allow for a junction box in a zone 1 near a hot tub? Guessing different standards, so maybe not, but just looking for solutions.

If it's safe enough to protect from a gas, presumably it is to protect from a water splash or wet hand? (Even though neither would be likely).

 

[flameport]

Junction boxes are not permitted within 2m of the tub.
What level of protection the box has is irrelevant.

 

[SUNRAY]

That was quick! I was just amending what I wrote as I was thinking it over

Is there any crossover at all, so that something like this would be allow for a junction box in a zone 1 near a hot tub? Guessing different standards, so maybe not, but just looking for solutions.

If it's safe enough to protect from a gas, presumably it is to protect from a water splash or wet hand? (Even though neither would be likely).

There is only one zone around a hot tub and that 2m means nothing electrical within it apart from the items within the hot tub and the original connexion cable supplied with it.
Everything else is excluded... Everything!

 

[trojanhawrs]

Guessing different standards, so maybe not, but just looking for solutions.

Fraid so.

If it's safe enough to protect from a gas, presumably it is to protect from a water splash or wet hand? (Even though neither would be likely).

Depending on the type of enclosure they're designed in such a way that if there's an explosion inside the box it's cooled and dispersed before the flame can propagate outisde the box. You need a special installers course to be certified to fit the equipment and it's only used for industrial applications.

How is the cable routed internally?

 

[rossyl]

Fraid so.

Depending on the type of enclosure they're designed in such a way that if there's an explosion inside the box it's cooled and dispersed before the flame can propagate outisde the box. You need a special installers course to be certified to fit the equipment and it's only used for industrial applications.

How is the cable routed internally?

Thanks for the help and advice.

I think the cable is possibly in the floor of the kitchen (which is the other side of the all) and then comes up and to the outside, but I can't be sure. It could also be under patio stones, but I doubt that as the patio was don't not long ago and I can't recall them mentioning that cable, they did mention another.

It'll be a bit of a shag and far more ugly to route a new cable.

 

[ericmark]

@flameport has answered your question. Not liking the answer will not change it. There is also the question about equal-potential zones, type of earthing, also what any pipes are made from, it looks to be outside, so there is a lot to consider, personally I would not do the job, too much can go wrong.

I only have the old version of BS 7671 and I know the rules have changed.

What does your electrician say, the last thing you want is after installed for the LABC to say no rip it out, new bathrooms are notifiable.

 

[rossyl]

@flameport has answered your question. Not liking the answer will not change it. There is also the question about equal-potential zones, type of earthing, also what any pipes are made from, it looks to be outside, so there is a lot to consider, personally I would not do the job, too much can go wrong.

I only have the old version of BS 7671 and I know the rules have changed.

What does your electrician say, the last thing you want is after installed for the LABC to say no rip it out, new bathrooms are notifiable.

It's just installing a hot tub, not a nuclear power station.

Hot tubs get installed every day.

Yes, it requires an electrician to do it.
Yes, I noticed that our junction box has been put in the wrong place for it.
Yes, I'm trying to find a solution for that.

Thank for letting me know your thoughts.
Cheers.

 

[mattylad]

Can the isolator be indoors? is it allowed for it to be next to the CU?

Can the light above be changed to a 12v one with the power supply inside the house?
The same for the other rope light.