Ssssssshhhhhh, don't mention Reform.

[Notch7]

They are a commercial vessel by definition of having more than 12 passengers. They must file and notify. It is an immigration offence not to. Even I have to do it with 4 passengers.

I wonder what article 19g says about a vessel that is in breach of customs and immigration laws?

you dont know if they do or do not have a passenger carrying certificate

 

[motorbiking]

I wasn't talking about berthing or handling in the harbour. I was referring to boats travelling at sea.
Remember we were discussing the time taken to reach a port depending on the wind, tide and sea conditions?
It may not be the nearest if the sea conditions prevent it.

Yes - its something you don't seem to understand.

We are discussing the tide between Dover and Calais at the point of departure and arrival. You will struggle to show a passage plan that makes the UK a faster destination from French waters than France.

I didn't invent the ludicrous concept of pushback.


You say it's not fair to describe all incidents at sea as unexpected?
That means we can prevent all accidents and incidents at sea?

Oh, look there an iceberg heading towards the Titanic. No worries, it was expected.

just posting boll@x now.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

17 Year to date 65 in 2024 - convictions for piloting small boats illegally.

Didn't they do well?

New research shows how people arriving on small boats are being imprisoned for their ‘illegal arrival’. Among those prosecuted are people seeking asylum, victims of trafficking and torture, and children with ongoing age disputes.

Report Launch: “No Such Thing as Justice Here”

New research shows how people arriving on small boats are being imprisoned for their ‘illegal

www.law.ox.ac.uk

 

[motorbiking]

you dont know if they do or do not have a passenger carrying certificate

Did they file paperwork, did they report, are they clearly compliant with the regs - they will know all this and it will be obvious.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

What they gonna do, build wall?
Talk about going round in circles.
You making the same incorrect interpretation of regulations, time and time and time and time and time and time again.


It's illegal, even if there were no accidents, it's still illegal to intentionally endanger the safety of another vessel at sea.
Pushbcks

Do they have laser levels that work at sea?
Or do they still use pieces of string?
Finding the exact line for the border. So that they can mark it, and the refugees would know where they are.

what are you on about?

I'll insert a sub- title for each section so that you can understand.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

the loading or unloading of any commodity, currency or person contrary to the customs, fiscal, immigration or sanitary laws and regulations of the coastal State;

Is a refugee, or 10 of them, 25? 50? a risk to UK's peace, good order or security?
All of them, or just some of them, or just the odd one?

 

[Deleted member 323070]

Sufficient to establish the fact that piloting a small boat full of illegals is not innocent passage.

All 0.4% of all the small boat arrivals suggests that they are all 'not innocent'?

What evidence was produced to arrive at the conclusion that they were not innocent?
What was the charge by the way?
You are hereby charged with being 'not innocent'?
Well that seems pretty conclusive.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

They would be if they are prevented from entering UK waters.

Who prevented then from entering UK waters?
Come on! Stand up, who was responsible?
Who intentionally jeopardised the safety of a flimsy overloaded boat?

 

[pete01]

Does TomWW ever shut up?.....
Jeeezzzus

 

[Deleted member 323070]

They are a commercial vessel by definition of having more than 12 passengers. They must file and notify. It is an immigration offence not to. Even I have to do it with 4 passengers.

I wonder what article 19g says about a vessel that is in breach of customs and immigration laws?

They can't be punished for their method of arrival.

Under existing British law, it’s illegal to enter the country without a visa or special permission. That means someone who reaches the UK on a small boat could face up to four years in prison.

But people who make the Channel crossing are protected by international law if they claim asylum once they arrive.

That means they can’t be punished while their application is being considered – and if they’re successful, they won’t be prosecuted for the way they arrived.

So, arriving by small boat is only illegal if you don’t claim asylum – or if you make an asylum claim and it’s rejected.

Though, even then, the chances of someone being prosecuted are thought to be low.

FactCheck: Is it illegal to cross the Channel on a small boat?

The answer is complicated.

www.channel4.com

Of course those ideologically opposed to any immigration will twist the regulation to support their ideology.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

Based on the definitions we have been using on this thread. This is a take back, not a push back.

Greece systematically pushing back migrants, rules ECtHR | Euractiv

This is the first time a court has confirmed the systematic nature of Greece's violations of migrants' rights.

www.euractiv.com

Oh! So that's why they described it as pushback?

 

[motorbiking]

I'll insert a sub- title for each section so that you can understand.

You making the same incorrect interpretation of regulations, time and time and time and time and time and time again.
It's your opinion that they are incorrect. You rely on a boat full of illegal immigrants on passage to the UK being protected by an asylum claim they haven't yet made. I've shown you that they get jailed for immigration offences and I've shown you that breaching immigration and customs laws is classed as passage that is not innocent. Its clearly written, you can't ignore the facts.

Pushbcks
Nobody is intentionally endangering life other than the skipper and trafficker of the illegal boat.

Finding the exact line for the border. So that they can mark it, and the refugees would know where they are.
No need to worry, it's already been done. There are plenty of free apps which show it.

They can't be punished for their method of arrival.

FactCheck: Is it illegal to cross the Channel on a small boat?

The answer is complicated.

www.channel4.com

Of course those ideologically opposed to any immigration will twist the regulation to support their ideology.

that killed your argument. did you read it?

 

[motorbiking]

Oh! So that's why they described it as pushback?

don't care, rounding up people in your territory and forcibly sneaking them to someone else's is not lawful.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

Yes - its something you don't seem to understand.

We are discussing the tide between Dover and Calais at the point of departure and arrival. You will struggle to show a passage plan that makes the UK a faster destination from French waters than France.

We were discussing the ludicrous idea of a pushback overcoming the force of the outboard motor.
So again you're conflating different issues.

just posting boll@x now.

You've been doing it for a while.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

Did they file paperwork, did they report, are they clearly compliant with the regs - they will know all this and it will be obvious.

They didn't show their passports to French Border Control neither.