In a garage, some distance away from the house, which might have a light and a socket in it - really?
External garage electricity wrongly connected to neighbours supply
- Thread starter Ematthews
- Start date
In a garage, some distance away from the house, which might have a light and a socket in it - really?
Not everyone, sublets their garages to a load of immigrants. My own extensive, and well lit garage and workshop, consumes but a few watt hours per year.
I disagree. I think that either (or both) is/are a lot more than slightly 'conceivable'.
To aid whom in "abstracting electricity"? Anyone swapping the supplies in order to 'abstract electricity' would thereby also be causing the other householder to 'abstract' theirs!
In the context of an entire electricity bill (for the whole house+garage), I really don't think many people would notice anything relating to the (probably very little) usage of electricity in a garage - and, in any event, as I have said, if electricity usage in both garages was 'similar', then there would be little, if anything, to 'notice' in the billing.
If there had been such an agreement between the two neighbours, then that might possibly be correct - but there clearly could have been no such agreement, since no-one was previously aware of the issue.
In the absence of any such agreement, the supplier would be billing both customers on the basis of metering which might be incorrect (conceivably 'very incorrect'), so they might well be concerned about the possible legal consequences of that.
Quite so - and, by the same token, in the situation you describe, there would be no reason why either customer would become aware of the issue (unless/until someone working for one of them attempted to isolate the supply to one garage).
The developers might well have known, but responded 'so what'. How would the subsequent owners find out - the power would work, the light would work, why would they bother to investigate?
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I have looked at these
I decided better to hard-wire the shed, but the move away from lead acid means leaving part charged no longer matters, and one of them would likely power my shed for a year, before it needs re-charging, and they do have the option to charge off solar panels. They also have other uses, like at the BBQ or going camping.
My one, mains powered, garden tool is the leaf blower, also works well with snow, and it is 3 kW, and for that power the portable battery is getting on the heavy side, and expensive. And my camping days are over. But looking at my neighbour, their garages are on a shared parking area,
top centre, and I can see how if the wrong supply went to each garage it would be a problem, house on right could easily put in a new supply, but house on left it would be a problem, as only cable route would be though the next doors front garden.
We all get on together so it would soon get sorted, if we had a problem, but I can see how if neighbours did not get on, it could be a problem. We have seen a plan from @SUNRAY but it does not show how easy or hard to move supplies. And once one party finds a way around the problem with for example the battery pack shown, then they will not want to pay out again for a second way around the problem.
My one, mains powered, garden tool is the leaf blower, also works well with snow, and it is 3 kW, and for that power the portable battery is getting on the heavy side, and expensive. And my camping days are over. But looking at my neighbour, their garages are on a shared parking area,
We all get on together so it would soon get sorted, if we had a problem, but I can see how if neighbours did not get on, it could be a problem. We have seen a plan from @SUNRAY but it does not show how easy or hard to move supplies. And once one party finds a way around the problem with for example the battery pack shown, then they will not want to pay out again for a second way around the problem.
How would they have known? Even the electricians who did it presumably did not know that they had made the error (otherwise would have corrected it) so how can the developers have known (particularly given that both garages had functioing electriocity)?
Quite so - until (as seemingly happened in the case which started this thread) someone attempted to isolate the supply to one garage (in order to 'work on'the garage electrics) and discovered (the 'proper way' or the 'painful' way!) that what they had done had not actually isolated the garage supply!
How could they manage to test the new installation, without noticing the error? Which means they either didn't bother testing, or chose to ignore the error.
The situation in my case has been RCD tripping, it's a fairly standard 5+5 2 RCD board and each time it tripped it reset okay, until the other day when it was raining, snowing etc.
Near me so I was called to see If I could localise and isolate the circuit.
N-E has over 1V so some potential for tripping, It didn't take long to find a very low resistance between N&E on the garage circuit and heading out to the garage somewhat surprised to find it powered, contact with the immediate neighbour soon established the mix-up (and for that matter isolated the wet light fitting).
They seem to be friends so not too concerned about the timescale to correct this, I made a comment about swapping garages and did they have the right ones so paperwork was extracted and inspected while I did final tests in the CU and closed up. The sequence I've shown is based on the house and garage original builders plot numbers which shows on the deeds, I didn't check the sequences either side.
Apparently further along the row there had been a mix-up with which garage was being used when a house sold and buyer found his garage keys didn't fit but I don't know about the power side of it.
Near me so I was called to see If I could localise and isolate the circuit.
N-E has over 1V so some potential for tripping, It didn't take long to find a very low resistance between N&E on the garage circuit and heading out to the garage somewhat surprised to find it powered, contact with the immediate neighbour soon established the mix-up (and for that matter isolated the wet light fitting).
They seem to be friends so not too concerned about the timescale to correct this, I made a comment about swapping garages and did they have the right ones so paperwork was extracted and inspected while I did final tests in the CU and closed up. The sequence I've shown is based on the house and garage original builders plot numbers which shows on the deeds, I didn't check the sequences either side.
Apparently further along the row there had been a mix-up with which garage was being used when a house sold and buyer found his garage keys didn't fit but I don't know about the power side of it.
lol
That would have been more amusing to find out they that been in the wrong garage for some time, esp. if they had been modifying it with shelving, workshop things etc.
That would have been more amusing to find out they that been in the wrong garage for some time, esp. if they had been modifying it with shelving, workshop things etc.
I suppose that 'black sheep' can sometimes be very black, but I find it hard to believe that any electrician even approaching being competent/conscientious (or even one fearing the consequences of 'being found out') would 'ignore' the fact (if they became aware of it) that they had wired part of an installation to the wrong supply!
I therefore can but imagine that full/proper testing was not undertaken - either because they overlooked (or couldn't be bothered to test!) the garages at all or else, if both houses/garages were wired before any testing was done on either, if they only undertook 'live' tests on the garage circuit(s) (i.e.no 'continuity' or IR testing).
Oh I can imagine exactly how this can happen:
No power in properties, all the dead testing is done (if any).
DNO/supplier arrive and apply power, all the live testing is done in the houses - then in the garages en-mass then the house CU's reset en-mass.
A little while back I did something similar in a hall, there are 3 supplies to the stage lighting, unsurprisingly numbered 1, 2, 3. left to right and the DB marked the same except during the DB change 1 & 3 had been wired swapped (some logic to it due to the percieved L/R relative position in the property). Doing testing the RCBO had to be reset several times, it didn't occur to us to question which one tripped. It only came to light when I set some lights up for a comedy evening - very simple 2 spots set very wide to nearly flood the stage and 2 floods to reduce the shadows - advised hirer to simply switch the right RCBO up marked STAGE LIGHTS 3... It had to be the 3rd from right MARKED STAGE LIGHTS 1. I corrected it at the local isolator with a bigger marker pen than the existing markings. Ordinarily all 3 would be operated at the same time so not an operational issue.
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Maybe I'm being dim, but could you perhaps explain that statement?
Other than in TN-C-S installations, there is not uncommonly a significant N-E potential difference (due to VD in the supply neutral) - and, indeed, even with TN-C-S there is not uncommonly a significant PD between the CNE/PEN (hence N & E within the installation) and 'true earth' (for the same reason). However, in no case does that result in any 'potential for tripping' of an RCD.
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