Trading Tips

[motorbiking]

Your buying window is still open.

 

[Wayners]

Here is a stat.
If someone put £5000 lump a global fund when you were born and left it 60 years.
You could retire with a tidy sum.
Here are the figures.
Conservative (5% annual return): ~£93,000
Average (7% annual return): ~£270,000
High (9% annual return): ~£770,000
Now historical figure is 9%.
It's a bit of a dream, but time in the market beats timing the market.

Like many I wish I knew this years ago.But that's life.

 

[pete01]

Here is a stat.
If someone put £5000 lump a global fund when you were born and left it 60 years.
You could retire with a tidy sum.
Here are the figures.
Conservative (5% annual return): ~£93,000
Average (7% annual return): ~£270,000
High (9% annual return): ~£770,000
Now historical figure is 9%.
It's a bit of a dream, but time in the market beats timing the market.

Like many I wish I knew this years ago.But that's life.

How would I do that for my son?

 

[Wayners]

@pete01
Junior Stocks and Shares ISA
Loads of information online.
I don't know much about it but a guy I know has set one up

 

[Justin Passing]

I think when you see '79% of traders lose money on our platform' when these companies advertise, it pretty much sums up trading ain't for everyone.

I started using a S&S ISA a few years back, wish I'd started a decade earlier.

That's specific to a particular type of platform.
The most difficult part, is detaching your emotions. Most people panic and sell when the price drops, so they constantly lose.
So start with a couple of quid, tell yourself it doesn't matter, try it on something you have a reason to like, then if it drops - just wait. Stick to mainstream stocks, and the're very likely to come back up sometime.
Minimum "quantity" is something like £1. You can buy 0.01 of some shares wth T212, not all.

I see JD is still trying to perpetuate some sort of myth about "investing" being different from Trading.
It's just slower. It's the same otherwise.
Plenty of "investments " you could have made in 2022 haven't been worth more at any time since. Longer is not necessarily better.
You could say that a regular arrangement to put money in, eg to the "world market", is investing, but you'd be stupid to do that if the market has fallen every day for months. You'd stick it in a building society then wait.
You still time the market, if you've got any sense.

Trading212 gets mentioned a lot. It's free for dumping money in and it's very easy to use, but there are better options really, maybe you have to learn a bit more for some and pay a few bucks for some. You get what you pay for, if you're lucky.
It's sort of snide:
You might see something moving slowly up and think you'll "invest " a bit.
The price is going 98, 99 ,100, 101, 102,.. 1% each day, so you buy £1000 worth.
The price you get may be 108. The price on the screen carries on 102, 103,104....
You complain and they give you a load of BS.
It's because of the way they get the prices, which I won't bother going into. Technically it's legit.
So you wait 10 weeks, and the price on the screen edges up, maybe it says 115.
You sell.
You get 107. So you made a loss of £9.26, plus any exchange fees.
Then it says 116, 117,118.

Happens all the time. You complain, and they're dismissive - more bs.
You must use Limit Orders to reduce the shenanigins, but often that means you don't get a trade at all.
They do not , unlike platforms with some sort of integrity, tell you a buy price and a sell price, or how wide the gap (called the "spread") is.
Also they don't show volumes properly, and some of their 'Indicators' are duff.

There's a lot to learn. None of it hard, but you don't know what you don't know. Unknown unknowns.
So start with a Practice or "Demo" account. You can do that on most platforms, eg T212.
There are lot of posts, mostly by me, in the Hobbies section - Stock Market dealing.

True - you'll see it: there was a guy for ages in that thread, buying and selling every day, who kept making losses. Nearly every time, he ignored basic "rules (of thumb)" of trading. Like buy a pullback in an uptrend.
He'd buy on some sort of hunch - some of his reasons were risible. He made the classic mistake, of congratulating himself when one of his hunches was lucky - it "proved him right". No, it didn't.
It's all about probabilities, you assess for good probabilities, try them and watch. If they start going backwards you get out. You may lose £1. But the ones that DO work for you earn maybe £6. So you can afford to be wrong sometimes.
If a stock has been dropping every day for 6 months, yes it'll probably start going up sometime, but probably not tomorrow. So DON'T BUY IT!
That's classic Investing, = dumb.
"Assessing" involves a lot, but market momentum is important and obvious. "Catalysts" are very important. You only need one. Then trade between "levels". That much will do.

WHen you start, you will almost certainly lose. I did. Then I turned £20k into £300k in about 3 months (I showed the bank statements), and carried on...
You get better. Even if that means doing nothing. I haven't done much today, just a couple of "reversion" reactions to the morning's drop off, with token amoounts
Everything dropped because Trump made a hole in a boat.
Bitcoin isn't related to oil really, so I thiought it might bounce back. Korea IS related, but they secured a lot of supplies, and they contain Samsung ans SK Hynix which are on a rip (broad bandwidh memory).
So this happened : This is the bitcoin related one. Obviously I was watching what bitcoin was doing.

It's about double those figures because I used a rise and fall, twice. You get to recognise when the tops and bottoms are coming, the slope of the line flattens. [ Checked - it's 25%.]
I won't hold that overnight - who knows what the mad people will do with guns and boats.

If you want to learn I can suggest (free online) books. They teach some basics.
Also go to youtube "Trader tv Live", and watch for a while starting at 13:30 or so ( before the US market opens) subscribe (free), and DO pay $5 a month to be a member. They send a load of pre-market research to your email. Hugely valuable. . Just reading it will tell you the sort of stuff that matters.
Even if you just watch you'll learn a lot once you've got the vocabulary, which does take a little while.
This guy is the Neal Roberts I mentioned. Cool dude. The usual other one, I mean Shawn, (not Joe) is a spiv. Clever but full of BS.
(they have a few ads but not a lot) Mid day US Eastern,they talk about small cap stocks (penny shares). I don't use those.

I suggest you use the SM thread in Hobbies for more.

 

[Wayners]

Oh.
I forgot to mention.
With trading 212 you can pretend to buy stocks.
Actually invested without spending a penny.
Could be fun for some.

 

[Wayners]

Oh
I forgot to say

Trading 212 you can buy gold and silver.
You can also buy crypto.
I don't though.
Gold went up 42% in the last year. What a run that was.
I often go looking at investments just for interest.
You can track prices and I find it fascinating

 

[JohnD]

@motorbiking

Yes sign W-8Ben.

Global funds have American stocks and you don't pay tax on American dividends.
UK and America have an agreement.
It's all linked with your national insurance number.
Just sign. Jump through hoop. Crack on

Actually, 15% American Witholding Tax will be deducted from your American dividends before they are paid to your account. You will see it on the American Dividend Statement. I have never failed to complete a W-88BEN but if you don't I believe they deduct more tax. I do it online now for each American company I have a direct holding in, and to the nominee that holds others

You can include this on your tax return when you list your Foreign Income and Foreign Tax Paid. HMRC gives double taxation relief.

You provide your NI number, and American IRS includes it with your name, address and payment amounts that they send to HMRC.

If the American Investment is held on an ISA or SIPP, you will not list it on your Tax return and you will not get double taxation relief or a tax form.

 

[Justin Passing]

With trading 212 you can pretend to buy stocks.

You can do that with most of the trading platforms

Trading 212 you can buy gold and silver.
You can also buy crypto.

You can't as such buy bitcoin there
You can buy ETFs (or ETC's) whose values mirror it, and you can buy shares in miners, dealers, etc.
That's how I made my first big round number
If bitcoin goes up say 3%, there are etfs which go up with it, but faster. MSTR goes up faster usually, and there's a 3x MST, also a 3x Coinbase.
They tend to be a bit laggy and lossy, so I mostly used $MARA, which would go up about 3x as much as bitcoin. I used it again recently,

In a CFD or spead-betting platform, you have LEVERAGE. (With the latter you don't pay tax)
The standard leverage is 5x.

Bitcoin trades 24/7, so you get a good idea which way things are heading before the market opens.

So I would buy, say £80,000 of $MARA. It sounds like a lot of money, but once it's all winnings, it doesn't feel as important. If I lost it, I knew I could win it again. Some days I'd double up if I'd let the account grow.
Bitcoin would often move 3% in the day, $MARA would go up 10%, sometimes more, near 15%. I usually used a couple of "names" - there are several.
With the leverage, using 80k, and a 50% gain. £40k in a day on 80k. Pays for tea and biscuits.
It wouldn't be every day, but some days gave double that, and some weeks were up on 4 of the days. When the account got over a round number like 100k, I'd slice the excess off into a proper bank account. Never trusted T212.
In ISAs you can't use CFD, but you can buy the leveraged "instruments", such as $3CON, or $3MST and that of course is tax free. So the Isas (I used my wife's as well) got quite large. You can look up how many ISA's there are over a certain figure - you might be surprised. It always surprises me if I add things up.

This was all to pay for my wife's extravagant retirement travelling, and living in a nice Home when the time came, or getting someone in. All her family live actively into their late 90's. She was to be the sort of jolly biddie you'd meet on a trekking holiday in Ougadougu or Inner Mongolia. She kept trim and fit. I've been falling apart for years with some degenerative stuff going on, so expected to keel over about now.
But is was she who died, suddenly. Silent heart attack, last October.
ISAs transfer as ISAs, in their wrapper.
No kids.
Not really sure what to do, now my life is hollowed out and about to collapse. I can't get about much so dibble on the SM. It's hard to concentrate now.