Add pir light to existing outside light !

[ih]

Hi i have outside led light i think 3w this operates from a switch i want to add outdoor bulkhead pir which is 60w so if the switch is left ON then pir is activated & so is led light also when pir is deactivated the led light also switches off ! Currently there is 3 core cable operating the led light also there is rated outside junction box!
Is this possible ? (Pir also needs 3 core) thanking in advance
Regards

 

[Taylortwocities]

It is possible, but you’ll need to find a PIR bulkhead that provides wiring access to the internal lamp. Many of the integrated units don’t have that these days.
One 100% way of doing it is to use a stand alone PIR and connect that to two separate lights.

 

[SUNRAY]

To clarify: You want the PIR to operate both the 60W bulkhead and the LED.

That is USUALLY easy as long as there is the switched line available within the fitting which has the PIR associated.

If there are 4 terminals in the new bulkhead as shown above (or 3 terminals if there is no earth facility). If the SL terminal is not available in the new fitting then you will not be able to control the existing fitting.

We can offer better advise if we have a picture of the new fittings terminals, we like pictures

Edit: started writing this before a long phone call or Taylors reply

 

[ih]

Many thanks TTC & SUNRAY ! and yes pir to operate both lights! Attached photo & installation guide
Look forwad for final input & thanks again

 

[Taylortwocities]

Ah, you already have bought the bulkhead........

As you can see, there is only provision for the live, neutral and earth IN to the bulkhead, and not the switched live OUT. So you would have to modify it.

You'll need to remove the plastic cover and access the wires to the lamp base. Identify the switched live and run that, the neutral and the earth to the additional light.

Does that make sense to you?

 

[SUNRAY]

I cant quite see the colours of the lampholder wires, looks like the right is grey or white but I can't see the left. One of them USUALLY goes to the neutral (blue in my sketch), the other is the one to intercept and create SL in the sketch.
If neither appear to go to neutral terminal then you may possibly not be able to modify it.

Edit: It looks like there are 2 brown wires on the L terminal, if that is so then my sketch is not the way to do it.

 

[ih]

TTC thank you! Am ok to follow diagram as provided by sunray before i uploaded photo! As the bulkhead does not
Have switched live there needs to be modification! Is it possible for you to draw diagram from the photo if not then
I will have to look for sparky or take up the option of stand alone pir thanks

 

[ban-all-sheds]

As the bulkhead does not
Have switched live

It does internally - the PIR module supplies it to the bulb. That's the one you have to find and use to also supply the existing light.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Is it possible for you to draw diagram from the photo

 

[SUNRAY]

View attachment 148652

A little caution first, if there are 2 browns on the L terminal it may be a switched Neutral.

I can't quite make out the detail in the pic but is something I experienced a few times.

 

[ih]

Hi sunray! Yes there are 2 browns on the L terminal

 

[SUNRAY]

Hi sunray! Yes there are 2 browns on the L terminal

In that case, I'm afraid you will need to have a good look and find out where all the wires go and report back.
Start with: does one of the lampholder wires go to the neutral terminal? - The colours in these fittings do tend to be a bit random to be careful.

 

[EFLImpudence]

The other light just has to be connected to these two wires (plus earth, of course).

Detach the lampholder and see if it will raise to expose more of the wires.

 

[ih]

Hi thanks all ! Facing the bulb holder from the left side there are two blue wires one is going to Neutral and the
Other is going to pir! From the right side there is white wire which is going to pir! Hope this info helps

 

[SUNRAY]

Hi thanks all ! Facing the bulb holder from the left side there are two blue wires one is going to Neutral and the
Other is going to pir! From the right side there is white wire which is going to pir! Hope this info helps

Excellent.
As EFL says connect across the existing new lampholder, for convenience one side can be at the neutral terminal and my previous sketch works, all you need to do is make a connexion to the white wire which will be the switched line (SL) in the sketch. If you are using 1mm 3C&E or T&E cable you may be lucky and find there is a second push-in connexion adjacent to the white wire in the lampholder (rather than cutting and fitting a lose connector in a limited space).

My sketch shows the use of 3C&E, it doesn't have to be done like that if it's not convenient.