Aga Er3 100i

Joined
22 Nov 2006
Messages
160
Reaction score
1
Location
Berkshire
Country
United Kingdom
The missus has been saving for years for the cooker she wants. I have an existing 6mm cable feeding the oven for this cooker (32A). This cooker also has a 2 ring induction hob and the instructions state it for the insuction hob it needs 'a separate single phase power supply - 13a fused three pin electrical supply. Should I be running a new cable (2.5mm) from the fusebox and then through a switched 13a FCU?. The retailer suggested taking a fused spur off the kitchen ring main.

Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks
 
Sponsored Links
Joined
27 Jan 2008
Messages
19,509
Reaction score
1,857
Location
Llanfair Caereinion, Nr Welshpool
Country
United Kingdom
I have tried to find the installation instructions and failed to find them for this model, in other countries it is common to have a split phase supply, and many cookers are designed so they can be configured to use a split phase supply if required, so it is possible that in UK you can use a single supply, but would need to read the instructions, if you can find the instructions on the internet and post a link then I and others can have a look, I can find Aga Er2 but not the induction version.
 
Joined
7 Jul 2010
Messages
38,285
Reaction score
4,630
Location
Retired to:
Country
Portugal
The missus has been saving for years for the cooker she wants. I have an existing 6mm cable feeding the oven for this cooker (32A). This cooker also has a 2 ring induction hob and the instructions state it for the insuction hob it needs 'a separate single phase power supply - 13a fused three pin electrical supply. Should I be running a new cable (2.5mm) from the fusebox and then through a switched 13a FCU?. The retailer suggested taking a fused spur off the kitchen ring main.
upload_2020-6-25_15-14-16.png


I don't know why the instructions state that but -

I would connect the oven AND a socket for the hob to the existing cooker circuit.


Can we have a picture of the rating plate which it says is behind the plinth?
 
Joined
11 Jan 2010
Messages
7,621
Reaction score
609
Location
London
Country
United Kingdom
View attachment 197172

I don't know why the instructions state that but -

It is yet another example of manufacturers instructions being wrong. All that about an isolator must be within 2 metres of the appliance is wrong as well as the regs don't even require a local isolator.

Prievous example of a cooker manufacturer with wrong instructions I'm sure you will remember:
 

Attachments

  • IMG_0165.jpg
    IMG_0165.jpg
    315.4 KB · Views: 174
Joined
31 Mar 2006
Messages
19,999
Reaction score
1,381
Location
Leeds
Country
United Kingdom
It is yet another example of manufacturers instructions being wrong

Why are they wrong? Specifically.
Do you know why the manufacturers ask for two separate supplies?
Why do you think you know what thier product requires more than the people who actually make it do?

the regs don't even require a local isolator.

Yes they do.
132.9
134.1.1
510.3
 
Joined
11 Jan 2010
Messages
7,621
Reaction score
609
Location
London
Country
United Kingdom
Regulation 134.1.1 of BS 7671:2018, states that the installation of electrical equipment shall take account of manufacturer’s instructions.
Regulation 510.3 Every item of equipment shall shall be selected and erected so as to allow compliance with the regulations stated in this chapter and the relevant regulations in other parts of BS7671 and shall take account of manufacturers' instructions.

Taking account or MI does NOT mean following them blindly. They are often wrong. There is no reg saying a cooker has to have a local isolator.
 
Sponsored Links
Joined
31 Mar 2006
Messages
19,999
Reaction score
1,381
Location
Leeds
Country
United Kingdom
There is no reg saying a cooker has to have a local isolator.

It does when the manufacturer specifies one. You’ve literally just quoted the regulation which says this. Do you consider completely ignoring the manufacturers instructions as taking them into account?

Do you think the manufacturer will honour their warranty if the product has been installed otherwise in accordance with their very specific installation instructions?

They are often wrong.


Why are they wrong? Specifically.
Do you know why the manufacturers ask for two separate supplies?
Why do you think you know what thier product requires more than the people who actually make it do?
 
Joined
22 Nov 2006
Messages
160
Reaction score
1
Location
Berkshire
Country
United Kingdom
So, would you say a separate supplying of 2.5mm cable from fuse box or spur off ring main? Thanks
 
Joined
27 Jan 2008
Messages
19,509
Reaction score
1,857
Location
Llanfair Caereinion, Nr Welshpool
Country
United Kingdom
We would have to say separate dedicated supply, because the regulations say non portable (and with weight of Aga it is not portable) over 2 kW should have a dedicated supply, however the tumble drier, washing machine, dishwasher and built in oven also fall into that and it is common for washing machines not to have a dedicated supply.

As to FCU it states 13A plug, not sure if this is some thing to do with maintenance? It seems likely the induction hob is independent so it can be completely removed for maintenance? I would think one of these
CM2456.JPG
would fit the bill, there is also a vertical version. I will admit I was also on two minds, hence the late reply, with the Aga power is used to keep the whole think hot, and on switch on it can draw power for some time reaching temperature, where with most stand alone cookers the heat stored it the cooker is kept as low as possible to give fast warm up times. However worst case scenario is the breaker on the consumer unit will trip, I think this is very unlikely and it would make sense for the supply in kitchen to come from something marked cooker, so the supplies can be isolated together.
 
Joined
11 Jan 2010
Messages
7,621
Reaction score
609
Location
London
Country
United Kingdom
It does when the manufacturer specifies one. You’ve literally just quoted the regulation which says this. Do you consider completely ignoring the manufacturers instructions as taking them into account?

The regulation says "take account of", not "follow blindly". Clearly when they are wrong you can ignore them. I have already linked to an example of wrong MI when they asked for a 16A fuse in a FCU. You can't even get 16A fuses for an FCU so clearly one has to ignore this.

Do you think the manufacturer will honour their warranty if the product has been installed otherwise in accordance with their very specific installation instructions?

Whether they honour it or not does not matter. It is in addition to your legal rights under the Consumer Rights Act.

Why are they wrong? Specifically.

They are asking for something that is not required and then telling you to fit this not required item within 2 metres.

Do you know why the manufacturers ask for two separate supplies?
Why do you think you know what their product requires more than the people who actually make it do?

Probably because the person that wrote that did not understand what is required.
 
Last edited:
Joined
7 Jul 2010
Messages
38,285
Reaction score
4,630
Location
Retired to:
Country
Portugal
So, would you say a separate supplying of 2.5mm cable from fuse box or spur off ring main? Thanks
No. Spur it off the cooker circuit.

I can find nothing on the web for the ratings, so let us know when it arrives.



then through a switched 13a FCU?.
According to some, you can't do that, can you? The Instructions say to use a plug.
 
Joined
31 Mar 2006
Messages
19,999
Reaction score
1,381
Location
Leeds
Country
United Kingdom
It does when the manufacturer specifies one. You’ve literally just quoted the regulation which says this. Do you consider completely ignoring the manufacturers instructions as taking them into account?

The regulation says "take account of", not "follow blindly". Clearly when they are wrong you can ignore them. I have already linked to an example of wrong MI when they asked for a 16A fuse in a FCU. You can't even get 16A fuses for an FCU so clearly one has to ignore this.

So because one manufacturer made one typographical error in one of their thousands of instruction leaflets, you think that is a green light to completely ignore all manufacturers instructions (not manufacturers suggestions) for the rest of time?

By this logic, can I tell everyone to ignore every post you make because you once posted something incorrect in a previous post?

Do you think the manufacturer will honour their warranty if the product has been installed otherwise in accordance with their very specific installation instructions?

Whether they honour it or not does not matter.

It would matter to me a great deal if I’d spent £1000s on an aga and it broke down, and the manufacturer would not repair it.

Why are they wrong? Specifically.

They are asking for something that is not required and then telling you to fit this not required item within 2 metres.

It is required because they require it. It is most likely so their field technicians can service and repair the product safely.

Do you know why the manufacturers ask for two separate supplies?
Why do you think you know what their product requires more than the people who actually make it do?

Probably because the person that wrote that did not understand what is required.

So the entire MIs was written by one person who was just guessing? Nobody at aga proof read the MIs?

I think the manufacturers have specificed two separate supplies and a local isolater because that is what they want.

Perhaps if you had ever worked as a professional electrician, or had even learned some of the theory and best practices, you’d understand why.

Just because you don’t understand something, it just not justify presenting your lack of knowledge as fact to people who are trying to install their product properly and in accordance with the MIs.
 
Joined
11 Jan 2010
Messages
7,621
Reaction score
609
Location
London
Country
United Kingdom
So because one manufacturer made one typographical error in one of their thousands of instruction leaflets, you think that is a green light to completely ignore all manufacturers instructions (not manufacturers suggestions) for the rest of time?

That is one example. There have been others.

It would matter to me a great deal if I’d spent £1000s on an aga and it broke down, and the manufacturer would not repair it.

The manufacturers warranty is typically one year. They could not deny service because you did not use an isolator, especially as such isolators are not used in other countries. The Consumer Rights Act is six years.

It is required because they require it. It is most likely so their field technicians can service and repair the product safely.

You are clutching at straws. They can repair it safely by switching off at the CU.

So the entire MIs was written by one person who was just guessing? Nobody at aga proof read the MIs?

Probably nobody did in these days of cost cutting.

I think the manufacturers have specified two separate supplies and a local isolator because that is what they want.

Yet other people on here have said otherwise.

EFLImpudance said: No. Spur it off the cooker circuit.

is an example.

Just because you don’t understand something, it just not justify presenting your lack of knowledge as fact to people who are trying to install their product properly and in accordance with the MIs.

I fully understand that an isolator is not required in the regs (which are not even statuary). I also fully understand the MI are guidance only and should be taken account of not followed blindly.
 
Sponsored Links
Top