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Leave him alone John , his "extending gas meter inlet" thread says it all. 
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B
Brightonguy
This thread is for the benefit of others as well.
Tell me how can ignoring the regs, modifying a boiler etc, several of which is likely illegal, be a benefit to others.
Dan, said he figured out how to fit a Wilo Smart pump in an Intergas and knew the wiring. Looking at their wiring diagram that is easy to figure out. We were talking about how it could be achieved and both of us stating the maker would not like it and guarantee would be void, but that did not stop two guys figuring it out. As they do. I noticed contradictions in the Intergas manual. Others thought we should not think of these sorts of things as we might go blind in doing so, and demanded the thought police to close down the thread.
The aim was to have thermo rad valves on all rads and prevent boiler cycling on the Intergas. But I came up with two solutions that conform to regs. One using an external Wilo Smart pump and flow switch. The other using two Smart pumps and flow switches in a two zone setup using a low loss header - the header was suggested by Dan. Both conform. If you had read the thread and understood it you would not have been confused and maybe have added something positive.
B
Brightonguy
Leave him alone John , his "extending gas meter inlet" thread says it all.
Maybe you like to have a flame thrower under your stairs. I don't. And the modern regs don't either.
Gas112 on that thread put you in your place.
B
Brightonguy
Dan. I noticed the low loss header on this picture. It is just under the boiler. It has a flow and return from the boiler into the top of the header. Then one flow pipe to the pumps of the many zones. Then the same for the return, one pipe into the header.
With a two zone setup using Wilo Smart pumps I was thinking of making up the header using 28mm pipe, which is simple to do. But each zone will have its own 22mm flow and return tee into the 28mm header. The two end tees on the header will be the flow and return to the boiler and inside these two tees, the tee for the flow and return of the two zones. Keeping the tees as close to each other as possible. This will mean the two CH zones will each access the neutral point of the header and not influence each other in operation as the Smart pumps run up and down in speed.
Dan, once again, a nice job.
Dan, would you please answer the Q about the HepVo rap on the Intergas. The manual is not very clear on this point. You deal with these boilers on an every day basis. Thanks.
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This should be a matter for your installer.
The intergas condensate and PRV are not linked.
The PRV should be copper.
The condensate plastic.
The boiler in my picture is not an Intergas or Atmos and has a different arrangement.
The intergas condensate and PRV are not linked.
The PRV should be copper.
The condensate plastic.
The boiler in my picture is not an Intergas or Atmos and has a different arrangement.
B
Brightonguy
"This should be a matter for your installer"
It is matter for me as it is going in my house. I noticed the boiler was not an Intergas but the principle is the same.
This Atmos on page 4 clear shows the boilers pressure relief valve discharging into a "self sealing waste valve", that is a HepVo trap, using a tundish (I presume a metal tundish). The condensing trap empties into the same drain after the hepVo trap. The Atag A325EC boiler has the pressure relief valves discharge into the same plastic pipe as the condensate - a Google brought that up. Both share same plastic pipe on the boiler. It make matters so much easier.
The ATAG manual clearly shows it, calling a safety valve.
http://www.atagheating.co.uk/db/pdffolder/data/id/filename/8G515906 INST MANUAL A SERIE 3WV 0613.pdf
The Atmos:
http://www.atmos.co.uk/wp-content/u...-Installation-Manual-2Dec08-Amend-18Jun10.pdf
This would make life much easier and no ugly copper discharge pipe on the outside wall.
It is matter for me as it is going in my house. I noticed the boiler was not an Intergas but the principle is the same.
This Atmos on page 4 clear shows the boilers pressure relief valve discharging into a "self sealing waste valve", that is a HepVo trap, using a tundish (I presume a metal tundish). The condensing trap empties into the same drain after the hepVo trap. The Atag A325EC boiler has the pressure relief valves discharge into the same plastic pipe as the condensate - a Google brought that up. Both share same plastic pipe on the boiler. It make matters so much easier.
The ATAG manual clearly shows it, calling a safety valve.
http://www.atagheating.co.uk/db/pdffolder/data/id/filename/8G515906 INST MANUAL A SERIE 3WV 0613.pdf
The Atmos:
http://www.atmos.co.uk/wp-content/u...-Installation-Manual-2Dec08-Amend-18Jun10.pdf
This would make life much easier and no ugly copper discharge pipe on the outside wall.
The reason I say it is for your installer is because you seem to think that what is good for the goose is good for the gander.
Just because one boiler does something one way does not mean you can do the same for another boiler.
And the fact that are looking at a Multi in the same point of reference as an Intergas is VERY alarming.
Just because one boiler does something one way does not mean you can do the same for another boiler.
And the fact that are looking at a Multi in the same point of reference as an Intergas is VERY alarming.
Dan - I av been away for two days - cant believe this is still rumbling on. For once I totally agree with DIA and must find some award for your patience?
Time to leave this loony tunes place & head back to sounder ground.
Time to leave this loony tunes place & head back to sounder ground.
B
Brightonguy
A boiler pressure discharge is well a boiler pressure discharge, as they all do the same thing at the same pressure, 3 bar. There is nothing alarming about that. I pointed out an Atmos that uses a HepVo trap and also an ATAG. If it is good for two domestic boilers, and others of course, it will be good for all.
Look at this. Two Intergas boilers. The low loss header has the two returns opposite each other. The the flow to the heating loops is above the flow from the boiler. This could just be one boiler and two CH zones.
Asking the installer how the headers work means he contacts the Intergas company and askes them how they do it. Domestic plumbers and low loss headers? Most have never heard of them. I would not trust one to design such a system. Many multiple headers tend to be like this for two zones. The boilers F & R are to the left.
Looking around the web it appears that the two inner tees are for the boiler F & R and the outers are for the zones.
Mr ecowarrior, yes it best you go elsewhere and stop playing the thought police. Unlike yourself, Dan is a thinker and he likes to bat the ball.
You have no idea how wrong you are.
Dan - u should listen - apparently u r going to learn something? Prime example of a small amount of knowledge being dangerous?
Oh - and remember - what is good for one is good for all
Oh - and remember - what is good for one is good for all
Yes. It's a shame that the op doesn't know the difference between a combi boiler and an unvented cylinder .
Some appliances are cleared for things some aren't.
.Some appliances are cleared for things some aren't.
M
MJGas
Ecowarrior not a thinker?
Not an adjective most of the regulars in the CC would ascribe to him is it.
What with being a Senior founding member of the TP party and all that.
What with being a Senior founding member of the TP party and all that
.
B
Brightonguy
What am I wrong on? If you are going to come out with one liners qualify them. Add value. Explain the way it is. You are passing yourself off as some sort of Expert on Intergas/Atmos, so tell us instead of coming out with disparaging remarks. Something tells me you do not know too much about the design of headers, etc, and you are a pipe fitter following drawing the engineer has given you.
You are all too keen to get personal and not answer questions. If you do not know just say so.For your info.....
The amount of water going around the system (radiators, cylinder etc) might be to much or to little for the boiler. Fitting a Low Loss Header allows the creation of a primary circuit, within which water velocity can be maintained at the required constant through the boiler, regardless of changes or requirements in the secondary circuits. The header is a neutral point in which the CH circuits can tap off.
In small domestic systems the maximum flow through rads and boiler may be well within the limits of the boiler, so no header is needed. In the case of two zones and two Wilo Smart pumps the header eliminates the need for an auto by-pass. But it may raise the return temperature reducing condensing efficiency using more gas.
So in a small system with two zones and two Smart pumps an auto by-pass and no header may be the best answer to increase efficiency and ensure the boiler pump does not pump against a dead-head.
Dan. I asked you what you thought of the auto by-pass idea and you never answered. It was clear you didn't know.
But if you do not know just say so. No probs Dan.DIYnot Local
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