Bathroom extractor fan

D

DIYLover38

I’m not sure if this is ok here or electrics, but here goes:

My main bathroom fan has stopped working. This happened to my en suite one, which is through the wall. I replaced this with an envirovent fan. The bathroom fan is ceiling fixed. I’ve searched the forum and it’s suggested that centrefugal ones are used for ceilings, is this the case? As a lot of the axil fans say they are ok for ceilings. Also can I use the existing duct or do I need a new one?

existing is 240 volt one

Many thanks.
 
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Centrifugal fans are used where long ducts are attached to the fan, as they have a much higher pressure.
Axial efforts are really only suitable for direct through the wall installations.

Ceiling or wall is unrelated.
 
Centrifugal fans are used where long ducts are attached to the fan, as they have a much higher pressure.
Axial efforts are really only suitable for direct through the wall installations.

Ceiling or wall is unrelated.

Thank you so much, flameport. Is there a reason why my newbuild came with an Axial one then? Would it have been cost or just laziness?
 
The cheapest, worst quality fans, that builders like to buy are axial.


But there are now some good, modern ducted axial fans, very quiet and powerful, and better axial fans have ball bearing motors so they can be installed in any orientation.

But we don't know how long your duct is, or what fan you have got, to compare it.
 
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.But we don't know how long your duct is, or what fan you have got, to compare it.
Thank you John. Duct is from first floor bathroom through loft to roof tile vent grille, approximately 2 - 2.5m? Existing fan is an Aura.
 
does it look like this? (observe the maker's logo)

airflow-aura-eco-100t-slim-humidity-extractor-fan-100mm-9041349_5802_1_large.jpg


Airflow Aura 100mm?

Is there a false ceiling (or room in the loft) where you could fit a larger one onto the ducting?

The one I show is modern and quiet, inexpensive, has a nominal throughput of 60m3/hr depending where you look.
I got some on special offer because they look almost identical to the Soler & Palau, but I found they are not as good. It doesn't have the rubber anti-vibration mountings, or backdraught shutter, and there is no mention of a ball-bearing motor in the spec, so more likely to wear and get noisy if mounted vertically.

If your room has a bath or WC, the extraction rate may be just enough, but if you have a shower, you can get much more powerful ones that will be more suitable.
 
If by false you mean plasterboard then yes it is. This is mine, possibly same company but changed logo? It’s a bath with shower mixer attached.
 

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that looks different, but IIRC Airflow amalgamated/took over some other manufacturer. Aidelle maybe? And the model may have a similar name but be different. Yours looks older. They did have some centrifugal models but it looks like your fan is in the centre of a 150mm square, so is probably axial.

Does yours seem noisy? Tech has improved dramatically in the past few years.
 
Take a photo of the ducting above the ceiling please. I think you probably have room for a better one.

Does your old fan come on with the light switch, and continue running for a timed period when you turn the light out?
 
Fan has been in about 10 years, but yes did seem quite noisy. It went even noisier before it stopped altogether.
 
Does your old fan come on with the light switch, and continue running for a timed period when you turn the light out?

No, it’s been wired up as a separate on/off switch. I’ll try and grab a photo of ducting this weekend.

Thanks.
 
look also for the electrical ceiling rose for the lighting, there will, with luck, be two or three cables going to it above the ceiling, one of which will be for the switch.

If you get a modern, near-silent, low-energy fan next time, there will be no objection to running it more often/for longer, which will do a better job.
 
The impeller fan has blades rotating around an axis and in general there is a reasonably smooth graph gas flow to resistance to gas, where the centrifugal fan again rotating around an axis but if you restrict the outlet the load often reduces, used a lot in motor vehicles as closing the vents reduces load, there are specials like the roots super charger which used lobes and a combination as used in the turbocharger, a special kind or turbine, turbine normally refers to many blades often one after the other with changing diameter as the air is compressed.

However there is not really a type which can't blow air over a distance, where I worked the impeller fan, often called axial fans, pushed the air 1 mile into the tunnel we were boring, clearly the so called axial fan (although since most rotate around an axis other than the roots types so most are technical axial fans) can push air a long way.

I assume an "an environment fan" is one of these
kair_heat_recovery_unit_fw.jpg
better know as a heat recovery unit? Often they are built into boxes
d105a_kit_1.png
and use centrifugal fans, but the type of fan is more down to how to physically fit the fan in the heat exchanger box than if it can push air a long way.

Often the main consideration is sound, that fan in the tunnel sounded like a jet engine, which is after all a collection of fans, and when a fan can be triggered in middle of the night sound levels are important, at the moment I have the window open and a large fan blowing air through the house, because it is running for a long time, although sound level is a bit on high side, I only become aware of sound when it stops.

So the heat recovery unit running 24/7 you end up ignoring the sound, but when it starts at 2 am it wakes everyone in the house.
upload_2020-8-18_9-18-2.png
this fan is not centrifugal but clearly designed to duct air.

I over the last 3 years have lived in three houses, two with bathroom fans and one without, the two with fans we switched them off and never used them, the one without we wished there was a fan, and I sat back and wondered why, and realised it was the design of shower cubical, one house wide open space no curtains just a wet room, no problem, the other a small glass cubical which sealed at the bottom once you closed the door, no problem, the third was in the bath and the chimney effect caused the water vapour to circulate, in spite of an open window, this room caused a problem, OK before the shower, but once the glass panels were fitted and the shower in the bath mould was a problem, oddly in the town of Mold.

But you need to look at it as a whole, type of cubical for shower, how sound travels, length of duct, drainage of duct, if window in room, if that window opens, how replacement air enters the room, and where from, is that air pre-heated or from a cold area, and how dry or damp is that replacement air.
 
I assume an "an environment fan" is one of these

Envirovent is a brand name. Among others, they offer a range of 100mm axial fans which look curiously similar to the excellent Soler and Palau range, and seem to have the same features, including quietness, rubber mountings, ball-bearing motor and backdraught shutter, but less expensive.

SLS100CRZ.JPG


envirovent_silent100_1_2.jpg
 

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