Blairs most foolhardy mistake re the NHS

[gasbanni]

Can you remember Blairs effort to fix the NHS ? He massively increased Doctors ( Gp's ) pay.

So what do we find ? Because of their enhanced salary's GP's don't need or have to work full time to have a nice lifestyle. But doctors wouldn't work less hours would they ? In their vocation ?

My wife has a different Gp to myself it's a small, one. They used to be a note on the opening hours they were closed on Thursdays for training .........every week.
The doctors and staff need a days training every week ! Really ?

Well guess what ( University of Manchester survey) .......

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lf-days-week-despite-six-figure-salaries.html

Maybe that's why it's hard for people to get appointments to see their Gp !

 

[Notch7]

wife has a different Gp to myself it's a small, one.

Is the height of her GP so small it causes a problem?

I used to play badminton with a couple, both GP's. salaries both over 100k, they work 4 days per week, dont do home visits.

All the same, I wouldnt want a GP that was only paid £25k pa. It is a pretty stressful job as well

 

[SirGalahad]

Typical gas the dumbo reading DM crap. The government through progressive new contracts has clawed back those salaries by changing their workload.

If it was such an easy option why do we have a shortage of GPs?

It's a huge problem as many are retiring due to the stress. A simple example, if a GP goes and does a home visit and the patient requires medicine then it's not enough for them to leave it to them to pick it up if you think they can't do that is old or have no transport. A GP has a duty of care.

 

[Yafo]

From his link.

Beccy Baird, senior fellow from the King's Fund, said: 'The biggest reason for both male and female GPs not wanting to work full time as a GP was the pressures of the working day.

'We need to do more to address the working lives of GPs, stress is going up, , they are retiring increasingly early. This isn't about lazy GPs who earn so much that they can afford to work part-time.'


My local surgery doesn't have enough doctors. That is the reason why it is hard to get an appointment. It's another problem of an ageing population too.

 

[SirGalahad]

You have a two sessions in a day, morning and afternoon but that doesn't cover admin - blood reports, referrals, discharge letters, etc

Roughly, about 80-90% of patient interactions are with gps but only 8-9% of the NHS budget.

The model we have is very good, having the gp being the primary care physician, it simply needs some tweaks and funding.

Yet dumbos only see one thing - they make their mind up early and stick with it.

 

[JP_]

No, I can't really remember it, it was over a decade ago. All the Tory austerity has fried my brain cells.

Anyway, one bit of research .... not so long ago ... "A survey of almost 1,200 GPs found 27 per cent regularly work more than 50 hours a week"
2017: GP BURNOUT IS RIFE More than one in four GPs are working beyond ‘safe hours’ each week

But, you have to ask, why are GPs working "part time"? Many, it seems, are also doing locum work. They are not being paid that full NHS salary if they are working part time. They are actually providing the service they were trained to do, in an environment that supports them and allows them to do their jobs properly.

But, many just don't want to work for the NHS, as the organisation is in tatters and the government is increasingly hostile to GPs and doctors, claiming that they are the ones that need to fix the problems.

So, if you want a better NHS and happier GPs, maybe ask May stop dismantling it and selling bits off to private companies who put profit before people, while expecting doctors to be able to maintain standards.

Here's some transparent research that tells a different story: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2034168/
According to Table 1, most part time male GPs work 34 hours a week - that's how many I do in my full time job!
Full time doctors work 49 hours a week.

I think that research mentioned in the Daily Fail needs scrutinising before we blame the actions of a government from over a decade ago on the current failing system.

 

[cwhaley]

I haven't had a good experience with a GP yet. I find them miserable, lazy and overpaid.

The GPs in the local health authority here are now demanding that they stop doing "district nursing jobs" such as wound dressing which they are currently doing on home visits to the particularly frail. As a result, the over-stretched and underpaid community staff nurses will see a surge in the number of visits they are expected to do in a day and there's no overtime pay. My partner already struggles to find the time to eat or go to the toilet, this is another level.

The last time I went to a GP, he was yawning when I walked in and seemed to be on power-saving mode. He also sat with me for a full 5 minutes recording notes into a Dictaphone before giving me a prescription.

With regards to working hours. Nursing staff at least in the community setting here work around 45-50 hours a week as standard at 37.5 hours' worth of pay. I know it to be the same in nearby authorities too. They never get the focus the GPs do for doing it and it's not fair.

 

[SirGalahad]

I haven't had a good experience with a GP yet. I find them miserable, lazy and overpaid.

The GPs in the local health authority here are now demanding that they stop doing "district nursing jobs" such as wound dressing which they are currently doing on home visits to the particularly frail. As a result, the over-stretched and underpaid community staff nurses will see a surge in the number of visits they are expected to do in a day and there's no overtime pay. My partner already struggles to find the time to eat or go to the toilet, this is another level.

The last time I went to a GP, he was yawning when I walked in and seemed to be on power-saving mode. He also sat with me for a full 5 minutes recording notes into a Dictaphone before giving me a prescription.

With regards to working hours. Nursing staff at least in the community setting here work around 45-50 hours a week as standard at 37.5 hours' worth of pay. I know it to be the same in nearby authorities too. They never get the focus the GPs do for doing it and it's not fair.

Is your local district nursing staff employed by a private provider? What you will find is that as GPs work load was changing they simply started dropping those parts of the contract they found offered the lower returns which was then picked up by the private health providers where the nurses are just being run into the ground. The amount of churn in district nursing is alarming.

 

[cwhaley]

No these are NHS staff -- my partner is a community district nurse employed by the NHS. The trust very rarely bring in bank nurses or private staff as the general decision is to ask for help from other teams who are themselves struggling. I'm not sure how it works in other trusts but I know that using private nurses is not the norm here. You are totally right about the churn!

The "duty of care" that GPs are supposed to have is questionable when they have said in simple terms that they don't want to do "district nursing jobs" anymore. They will do home visits but now don't want to dress or clean wounds as it's below them.

These views are only the opinion and experience of my household of course. I haven't read any DM articles on this.

 

[SirGalahad]

It depends on the district and contract. The problem is that someone at the top was influenced by Mckinsey et al that we could create a healthcare market with contracting work out - it would be a nirvana. The problem has then become organisations have picked and chosen the contracts they want to do creating a disjointed service. Healthcare needs to be integrated - it works more efficiently that way but if you are a free market ideologue then there always has to be a free market solution.

 

[durhamplumber]

They deserve every penny sat all day with so many scratter patients.

 

[sodthisforfun]

I haven't had a good experience with a GP yet.

Nor me. In fact, I'd say due to their ineptness they have made my life considerably worse for the long run. I try not to go to the docs anymore but if I have to, I research before I go in.

GP surgeries have to pay for referrals and tests and what people forget is that local surgeries are there to make money. So when they make cutbacks, they cutback on all sorts, including sending people off to have scans and see specialists etc and often just give a pill instead. Life changing decisions made for the patient and not duty of care imo.

Oh, just found this: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-hospital-treatment-reward-cash-a8231591.html
Awful.

 

[Yafo]

Nor me. In fact, I'd say due to their ineptness they have made my life considerably worse for the long run. I try not to go to the docs anymore but if I have to, I research before I go in.

GP surgeries have to pay for referrals and tests and what people forget is that local surgeries are there to make money. So when they make cutbacks, they cutback on all sorts, including sending people off to have scans and see specialists etc and often just give a pill instead. Life changing decisions made for the patient and not duty of care imo.

Oh, just found this: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-hospital-treatment-reward-cash-a8231591.html
Awful.

And the other side of the coin.

Thankfully I have not had much reason to visit a doctor, but on the few times I have needed them I have found them helpful, able and useful.

From a family point of view, with very ill elderly parent, they couldn't have done any more. Pressure on hospitals to get correct attention and treatment. Very happy with them.

Are there enough doctors and back up systems to provide help and care everywhere, undoubtedly not. And I guess it must be different from surgery to surgery, let alone area to area. But prasie where it is due, not into knocking them.

Knock the system, yes, it needs a desperate overhaul. Like councils in a way, it needs a lot of the managers and such like removing and a fresh start, or as much as is possible. Too many people protecting their jobs, not the service they should provide.

 

[Notch7]

I find my doctor and surgery very good.

And very handy, I can walk there.

The systems they have a quite up to date, online booking, online prescription renewal, test results online. Self book in screens when you go i nfor an appointment -all useful technology that helps save money.

I take my father quite regularly to eye appointments he has multiple eye problems, cataracts, glaucoma, macular degeneration. Overall they do a pretty good job and the staff are usually very helpful and friendly.

The NHS has its faults but that is political, the staff are generally dedicated.

I do think there is a case of taking something for granted when we don't have to pay directly for it.

The NHS is underfunded, but the German and French systems are very expensive and they are finding it hard to keep pace with increasing cost.

 

[SirGalahad]

Nor me. In fact, I'd say due to their ineptness they have made my life considerably worse for the long run. I try not to go to the docs anymore but if I have to, I research before I go in.

GP surgeries have to pay for referrals and tests and what people forget is that local surgeries are there to make money. So when they make cutbacks, they cutback on all sorts, including sending people off to have scans and see specialists etc and often just give a pill instead. Life changing decisions made for the patient and not duty of care imo.

Oh, just found this: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-hospital-treatment-reward-cash-a8231591.html
Awful.

As I mentioned above - the system is being set up to reward this and it's why thankfully Hunt was challenged on his attempts to bring forward some awful changes to the NHS.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-privatisation-customers-id-pay-a8033986.html

Irrespective of party only a fool or someone who stands to profit would want to "Americanise" our healthcare system. The American system works for no one apart from corporates.

In the US the doctors pay through the nose for Indemnity Insurance. Patients are paying through the nose for Health Insurance with rising excess / copays.

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/07/03/health/subway-accident-insurance-fear-trnd/index.html

She was so scared she couldn't afford an ambulance even though she needed it.

The NHS is a GREAT BRITISH ESTABLISHMENT - should make you proud to be british.