Build internal leaf wall without wall starter set.

Discussion in 'Building' started by iwanttodiy, 26 Apr 2018.

  1. iwanttodiy

    iwanttodiy

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    hi guys,

    I’ve currently been let down by a steel supplier after they have quoted for steels and are no longer honouring their price and delaying the delivery of the steels

    The builders unfortunately are unable to continue building the inner leaf of the extension as they need to tie the blocks onto the steels.

    Does anyone know if they can put the blockwork up first and then retrospectively tie the blocks to the steel once the steels arrive later?
     
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  3. freddiemercurystwin

    freddiemercurystwin

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    How are the blocks tied in? Got a detail showing it?
     
  4. iwanttodiy

    iwanttodiy

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    SE didn’t provide a drawing that shows how the Steel is tied into the blocks. He mentioned it’s up to the builder.

    Builder says he was going to bolt a wall starter to the steel and build off that.
     
  5. ^woody^

    ^woody^

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    Wtf?

    Is the wall and stantion designed to move independently of each other?

    At times like these a proper builder comes in handy.
     
  6. iwanttodiy

    iwanttodiy

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    Sorry, I don’t understand? If wall starter kit goes in, is the blockwork not tied in?
     
  7. Ian H

    Ian H

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    A wall starter would normally fix a new wall coming off an existing wall at 90 degrees.
     
  8. freddiemercurystwin

    freddiemercurystwin

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    So they should be frame ties off the column, how can they be fitted to the wall before the column? Sounds like your engineer is as daft as your builder.
     
  9. iwanttodiy

    iwanttodiy

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    I know, I’m panicking already, as I feel like I’ve been screwed over by the SE and builders...

    However to try keep positive without leaking money like a waterfall.


    So, your suggesting that frame ties should be used instead of a wall starter kit?
     
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  11. freddiemercurystwin

    freddiemercurystwin

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    There are many different tie systems designed to retain masonry to steelwork that could be utilised but the steel needs to go in first as its the mortar that provides the tolerance between the masonry and the steel.
     
  12. ^woody^

    ^woody^

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    Wall starters are designed to provide some connection but it's a flexible connection so that the extension joined to the main building can move up and down on it's new foundations. Starters provide little restraint horizontally.

    The stantion can go in afterwards if the wall can slot in to the web and be bolted through the flange. Otherwise it needs some horizontal strapping. But this will rely on the builders building the wall dead plumb, and I don't think they are capable of that.

    But you have employed thick people. You have had problems before even digging, problems in the foundations and now problems on the first bit above ground. What does that say to you?
     
  13. wessex101

    wessex101

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    Not ideal but how about building the inner skin but leaving it toothed out where it meets the steel. Then when the steel eventually goes in finish the blockwork.

    It will be a PITA but better than stopping work for a couple of weeks until the steel arrives. Obviously if the steel is only going to be a couple of days late then probably not worth the hassle.

    DIY project management can be a doddle when you've got a good builder. I suspect the OP is in for a rough ride.
     
  14. iwanttodiy

    iwanttodiy

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    I know, unfortunately I’ve paid them now, so nothing I can do except push on... So far they have drained my energy, and my money....

    What we were thinking is build the inner leaf, and when the steels go in, fill the gap between steel and blockwork with mortar then bolt the steels into the blocks and use SBD to glue it in.
     
  15. Notch7

    Notch7

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    Are they special steels you are ordering, or steels with some special fabrication work?

    I can get standard structual steel like UB, UC, equal angle, SHS etc in around 3 days. For EG, yesterday I ordered 2no equal angle 150 x150 x15 which are being delivered this afternoon.
     
  16. iwanttodiy

    iwanttodiy

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    B1 - 300x90x41 twin beam - 6m
    B2 - 178x102x19 UB @ 2.9m
    C1 - 203x203x46 UC @ 2960mm overall including bearing plate and capping plate.
    B3 - 150x90x24 Twin PFC 100mm cavity. @ 4.7m
    B4 - 2 of 152x89x16 @ 302mm
    B5 - 2 of 152x89x16 @ 3.9m

    I managed to find a place who says they can do it for Tuesday, but I’ve been let down once already....
     

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  17. tomfe

    tomfe

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    Tuesday for the fabrication as well as the steel seems a little optimistic but maybe they don't have a lot of work on.
     
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