Buying a house - no certificates for work?

[DavidA1982]

Hi all

I am buying a 1930s semi. It's a probate sale, and the vendor cannot find any certificates for the electrical work that has been carried out. There are clearly some old circuits in there with sockets on skirting boards, but there is also a very new-looking CU - it looks no more than a year old.

I'm trying to work out how best to proceed. Is it possible for them to regularise the work? If it is, is it reasonable for me to request this?

Thanks!

 

[flyingsparks]

Get a EICR done. That's a Electrical Installationi Conditoon Report. It should detail, if done properly any faults and non compliances Witt he installation. Then you could get a quote to put right any thing found, and deduct this much from the cost of the house.

 

[securespark]

Cost of house: 500K?

Cost of rewire: 5K?

Knock it off the asking price...

Chances are it'll need work doing if sockets are on the boards.

 

[DavidA1982]

Thanks. I like the sound of the EICR. I'm not sure the seller has any appetite for price-chips, but at the very least I want to make sure that I know what I'm in for (and I can pull out if it needs stripping out completely).

 

[ban-all-sheds]

As secure says, if it still has sockets on skirting boards you're very likely to want a fair bit of work done anyway, no matter what the condition of the circuits is, just to bring it up to modern functional standards.

If you don't think that the seller would budge even with a report showing that electrical work was needed for safety reasons, then save your money, budget £5K for a cellar-to-loft rewire and press on.

If you can get any electrical work done before you move in, and fill the house with furniture, carpets, curtains, clothes etc, and/or people who will moan about no electricity, dust, and missing floorboards it will be cheaper.

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

I would contact Building controls, inform them that you intend to purchase a property, which no documentation can be found and enquire if any applications, notifications have been forwarded to them and if they have been approved and signed off.
If they have ask for copies or/and details of contractors. If not, then request to the vendor that an EIRC is performed prior to purchase.

 

[JohnW2]

I am buying a 1930s semi. It's a probate sale, and the vendor cannot find any certificates for the electrical work that has been carried out. There are clearly some old circuits in there with sockets on skirting boards, but there is also a very new-looking CU - it looks no more than a year old. I'm trying to work out how best to proceed. Is it possible for them to regularise the work? If it is, is it reasonable for me to request this?

Over the years, I've been involved (on the vendor's side) in a few probate sales and, given the usual dearth of historical documentation, have always made it clear that the property was being sold 'as is' and that the asking price had been chosen to take that into account. Particularly if, as you imply, it is visually obvious that some of the electrical installation is old, and probably could do with upgrading, I would (as vendor) regard that as part of the 'as is' and wouldn't enterain any attempts to reduce the price, or to get me to pay for an electrical inspection (EICR), because of that. I wouldn't (as vendor) expect to pay for a purchaser's structural survey, so why should I be asked to pay for an EICR?

From your viewpoint, what you need to decide whether or not you want (e.g. for 'cosmetic' reasons') to have a complete rewire (maybe utilising the existing CU, if it really is as new as you suggest). If so, then just budget for it. If not (or if you're uncertain), then get an EICR done and make your decision on the basis of the findings. As has been said, any major electrical work would certainly best be done before you move in.

Kind Regards, John

 

[kbdiy]

I am buying a 1930s semi. It's a probate sale, and the vendor cannot find any certificates for the electrical work that has been carried out. There are clearly some old circuits in there with sockets on skirting boards, but there is also a very new-looking CU - it looks no more than a year old. I'm trying to work out how best to proceed. Is it possible for them to regularise the work? If it is, is it reasonable for me to request this?

Over the years, I've been involved (on the vendor's side) in a few probate sales and, given the usual dearth of historical documentation, have always made it clear that the property was being sold 'as is' and that the asking price had been chosen to take that into account. Particularly if, as you imply, it is visually obvious that some of the electrical installation is old, and probably could do with upgrading, I would (as vendor) regard that as part of the 'as is' and wouldn't enterain any attempts to reduce the price, or to get me to pay for an electrical inspection (EICR), because of that. I wouldn't (as vendor) expect to pay for a purchaser's structural survey, so why should I be asked to pay for an EICR?

From your viewpoint, what you need to decide whether or not you want (e.g. for 'cosmetic' reasons') to have a complete rewire (maybe utilising the existing CU, if it really is as new as you suggest). If so, then just budget for it. If not (or if you're uncertain), then get an EICR done and make your decision on the basis of the findings. As has been said, any major electrical work would certainly best be done before you move in.

Kind Regards, John

I would agree - as a vendor I offer a property for sale as seen and you have clearly seen that you consider electrical work is necessary and agreed a price accordingly. These days solicitors seem particularly 'hung up' on asking for certificates for everything and purchasers seem nervous when they cannot be produced. In short, accept it for what it is and budget accordingly. As this is a probate sale it is probably going to be even more difficult to drive the price down any further anyway.

 

[DavidA1982]

I am buying a 1930s semi. It's a probate sale, and the vendor cannot find any certificates for the electrical work that has been carried out. There are clearly some old circuits in there with sockets on skirting boards, but there is also a very new-looking CU - it looks no more than a year old. I'm trying to work out how best to proceed. Is it possible for them to regularise the work? If it is, is it reasonable for me to request this?

Over the years, I've been involved (on the vendor's side) in a few probate sales and, given the usual dearth of historical documentation, have always made it clear that the property was being sold 'as is' and that the asking price had been chosen to take that into account. Particularly if, as you imply, it is visually obvious that some of the electrical installation is old, and probably could do with upgrading, I would (as vendor) regard that as part of the 'as is' and wouldn't enterain any attempts to reduce the price, or to get me to pay for an electrical inspection (EICR), because of that. I wouldn't (as vendor) expect to pay for a purchaser's structural survey, so why should I be asked to pay for an EICR?

From your viewpoint, what you need to decide whether or not you want (e.g. for 'cosmetic' reasons') to have a complete rewire (maybe utilising the existing CU, if it really is as new as you suggest). If so, then just budget for it. If not (or if you're uncertain), then get an EICR done and make your decision on the basis of the findings. As has been said, any major electrical work would certainly best be done before you move in.

Kind Regards, John

Thanks John - makes a lot of sense.

They cannot do anything to satisfy me that the new electrics (the kitchen) have been done safely, and as I said, we are going to want to replace a lot of the other circuits anyway. I was hoping for some certainty over the kitchen as replacing that is going to be a huge ball-ache (the walls are completely tiled). I don't want to live in a house with cowboy electrical work and so I think the best bet is just to get a full rewire done. You mention that you would recommend doing it before I move in, which is exactly what I'd want to do. However, realistically that means between exchange and completion. I'll ask, but I doubt I'll get.

 

[SimonH2]

Just bear in mind that having a handful of certificates tells you nothing other than someone signed a load of bits of paper. It doesn't guarantee that whoever signed them was actually competent (but the chances are somewhat higher than for DIY), but more importantly it only tells you about work for which there are certificates - but nothing about anything else, especially any DIY work on those same circuits done since.

In other words, there may have been a new CU fitted, and someone may have signed that off having done a good job and tested it, but there's no guarantee of what might have happened to that since. And when doing the CU, the installer (unless specifically asked to) probably did no more test and inspection that was required in order to assure himself that the rest of the installation was passable to be connected to it. Worst case if he did nothing more than a quick R1+R2 and IR test on each circuit.

And of course, until 2005, there wasn't a requirement to notify any works anyway...

So just assume it'll need electrical work doing, and work from there.