Carbon dating some old heaters?

[Dartlec]

Any old timers on here able to date this heater for me? 5 of them fitted in a local Parish Council hall and only one is left working, though the fans work on all. They are branded GEC and look out of the ark to me, but them I'm not as long in the tooth as some members

I am planning to quote on replacements, but since the building is falling down they don't want to go mad.

I was planning on suggesting some of these quartz heaters at about 90 a go, but if anyone has any better (cheaper) suggestions I'd welcome them.

Also out of interest, and since I know how you all like piccies, anyone care to tell me the significance of this to the left of the CU - labelled 'Maximum Load Indicator'?




Apart from showing me that I have 21000W, or just over 90A available on this three phase supply (it says 3x30A on the scale anyway), is it there for a purpose?

I don't normally deal with 3 phase so maybe this is a common feature, or have I discovered another oddity? I seem to have a knack for that recently.

All the three phase supply is feeding is the 5 (was once 6) heaters, via this rather behemothic fusebox -

Though it does appear to be well installed, with 30A rewireable fuses and singles fed in metal conduit.

PS. Yes that is a plant growing up through the meter cupboard

 

[young-gun]

well u could have them at 80quid a pop http://www.screwfix.com/prods/38168/Heating-Cooling/Electric-Heating/Quartz-Patio-Heater-1-3kW

 

[JohnD]

I don't know, but I'm going to guess the max load is to do with the Tariff. It is marked Seeby so pretty old.

there used to be (might still be) strange tariffs for "Places of Worship" the idea being that they were mostly used outside the working week or something, and the Parish Hall might have been on one of these strange tariffs. It might have been withdrawn for new customers but still available to people with an existing contract. they might have had a low standing charghe as low users.

I have a very vaugue idea that you could be in a charging band dependent on your peak demand during the quarter, but I might be imagining it. It's something I will once have heard about but not been interested in.

Mr Blobby here might remember but he isn't saying. He's led a varied life.

 

[Dartlec]

I don't know, but I'm going to guess the max load is to do with the Tariff. It is marked Seeby so pretty old.

Ah, that makes some sense, so the needle will just record the maximum load used during a charging period, and going over a set figure would trigger additional charges...?

Presumably this would only work if someone bothered to come and read (and reset) the meter occasionally, and knew what they were looking at too.

Mr Blobby here might remember but he isn't saying. He's led a varied life.

Damn you Mr Blobby!

 

[RF Lighting]

Can I just stop you there.

Those patio heaters are most probably not suitable for the type of room you are wanting to heat.

They are great if you are sat right under them, but they do not actually heat the room.


Them GEC heaters are probably 1970s, but I have to wonder if it is merely the thermal overload which has operated. If so, you can just reset it and save your self alot of money and hastle.


The maximum demand meter looks out of place in that installation. Was it formely an industrial premisis?

They used to be commonley installed in factories, but I've not seen them used in light commercial premisis before.

That TP supply is a bit old, and fits with the age of the heaters, but I don't see anything that concerns me with it.

 

[securespark]

Yeah, I would date them somewhere between late 60's to early 70's, as per Roberto.

 

[Dartlec]

Them GEC heaters are probably 1970s, but I have to wonder if it is merely the thermal overload which has operated. If so, you can just reset it and save your self alot of money and hastle.

I did wonder that, but was no visible reset switch and I didn't want to pull them off the wall just yet since I was just quoting. Is it possible they may have a fuse inside? The elements don't look in that good condition so I wouldn't be surprised if they have just corroded away.

The premises is currently used for a nursery group, so whatever I put in their place will need to be out of reach or safe from little fingers, hence why standard convection heaters are an issue. I did wonder about an air curtain, but the wooden walls are literally rotting away so I doubt they would support anything that substantial.

I guess I could just replace them with standard bathroom type downflow heaters, which would have the advantage of cheapness at least. The Quartz heater was a suggestion by my electrical suppliers, but I have never used them so thanks for the advice.

Its always been the Parish Council's AFAIK, but obviously there are no records or certificates, so I have no idea how long ago the install was done. It is probably the sturdiest thing about the building though

 

[flameport]

Can I just stop you there.
Them GEC heaters are probably 1970s, but I have to wonder if it is merely the thermal overload which has operated. If so, you can just reset it and save your self alot of money and hastle.

Spot on - saw 20 of those heaters in a shop a few years ago, and they had been installed in 1970. Xpelair made a similar one about the same time, but that had a square casing.
They have a red button in the top, press to reset.
Nothing in them to go wrong - just a fan and the heating elements.

 

[RF Lighting]

Bump this topic tomorrow evening when I've a bit more time

 

[Dartlec]

They have a red button in the top, press to reset.

That will teach me to drag my steps out of the van next time I go to look

Thanks for that I'll have a look next week and see - wonder how much I can charge for 'pressing red button'

RF - Thanks, will do

 

[JohnD]

Travelling Time £40
Site visits 2 @ £100 (min) = £200
Provide, Position and Assemble Access Equipment for Working at Height £60
Referral to Specialist Consultant Engineers: £200
Diagosis of faults £200
Adjustment of thermo-mechanical electrical interlocks - 4 @ £60 = £240
Operational and safety tests £200
Sundries £25
Preparation of documentation £30

Less discount for non-profit client (£12)

 

[Dartlec]

Adjustment of thermo-mechanical electrical interlocks - 4 @ £60 = £240

Ctrl + C

 

[Dartlec]

Bump this topic tomorrow evening when I've a bit more time

Bumped

 

[RF Lighting]

Hi


I think the first thing to do is try pressing the reset button ontop of the heater casing. You can just see it in your first picture.

If this doesn't work, then I'd whip the cover off ant test the element for continuity. If there is continuity then you can start tracing the power through the heater, and see what is causing it not to work.

If there is no continuity, the it's probably time to replace the heaters. I doubt you'd be able to get spares for them now.

You can get a modern equivqalant for a price similar to what you budgeted for those IR heaters. You may find them cheaper than this if you search around.

http://www.e-tradecounter.co.uk/Heating/Commercial_Heating/Fan_Heaters/PFH30.html

Though it does appear to be well installed, with 30A rewireable fuses and singles fed in metal conduit.

Just FYI, that is MICC (pyro) cable. Much better than singles / conduit

 

[333rocky333]

Cannot tell from pic but is there a controller between spur and fan.

If there like the old ventaxia ones you had two supply lives
One for fan and one for heat so you could wire to an optional summer / winter switch controller , or you could just link out, in the fan for heat only.

On some heaters if the fan was slow or seized the overheat would trip them , as others said you can sometimes just reset it and if there was an oil hole on the motor , drip some in.

However some heaters, afaik had an extra thermal resistor thing crimped in series, with the element,once blown this would have to be physically replaced.

Also sometimes the controller would fail rather than the fan unit.
Best to spin the blade with the power off, if the motors tight ,proberly not worth testing further.