disconnect neutral as well as live ?

[dinoben]

Hi. Any advice much appreciated. My immersion heater cable ends in a 3 pin plug, and that plug went into a wall socket in the airing cupboard. The socket was old and burnt, clearly there is a problem, whether just a loose connection in plug or not I don't know). I've removed the socket to reveal 2 cables running into the wall. Each cable contains a live, neutral & earth. These then go back to an old style fuseboard.

I don't wish to use the immersion any more. To get enough cable out of the wall to clamp into a junction box to render that end safe will involve a lot of work. So, if I simply remove the 2 live wires where they go into the fuse holder at the fuse board, which will take all of a minute, will this be sufficient to render the circuit dead/safe and enable me to leave the wires exposed in the airing cupboard. Or do I also need to remove the 2 neutral wires where they connect in the fuseboard too (which isn't so easy as they are much harder to get to).

Seems like a simple question, hopefully it is, but I am aware things often aren't as simple as they seem.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Why not just fit a new socket?

That there are two cables indicates that there is something else being supplied.

 

[JohnW2]

That there are two cables indicates that there is something else being supplied.

The OP seems to imply that there are two cables in parallel going from the socket to the fuseboard. However, that seems very odd, so I wonder if the OP has correctly interpreted where the cables go ... so what you say might possibly be right.

Kind Regards, John

 

[dinoben]

Thanks. Where they come out of the wall and enter the socket the 2 lives were wound round eachother, the 2 neutrals wound round eachother and the 2 earths were wound round eachother. I suppose it is conceivable they also supply something else (eg may be a former wall fire in bathroom) but nothing I currently need to use.

 

[JohnW2]

Thanks. Where they come out of the wall and enter the socket the 2 lives were wound round eachother, the 2 neutrals wound round eachother and the 2 earths were wound round eachother. I suppose it is conceivable they also supply something else (eg may be a former wall fire in bathroom) but nothing I currently need to use.

As EFLI implied, that does seem more likely. Did you have any reason for thinking that both cables went back to the fuseboard, or was that just an assumption?

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

Ok. Are they connected to a 15/16A device in the consumer unit?


Anyway, if you want to disconnect the circuit, you should disconnect the Lines(lives) and neutrals at the consumer unit and connect them to the Earth bar.
At the socket position - AFTER the above has been done - all six wires should be connected together to show anyone in the future that they are not being used nor live.

 

[Taylortwocities]

Got anything up in the loft that is beling powered by that circuit?

TV amp, intruder alarm, etc.

Ok. Are they connected to a 15/16A device in the consumer unit?

That is an important question.

Before you do anything radical or disconnect anything, I suggest that you first identify the fuse in the fuse board for that circuit (it will probably be a blue/15A fuse). Remove it and see if anything else stops working.

 

[dinoben]

Thanks for the comments. My fundamental question is this. If for a particular circuit you disconnect the neutral wire at the fuseboard but not the live then current can still run in the live wire, but what about the other way round ie. when you disconnect the live but not the neutral can current run in the neutral. If it cant can there be any need to disconnect it as well? In other words if you were simply to attach a new wire to the neutral block in the fuseboard can current flow in it.

As to my specific situation I will check whether if I unwind the 2 cables at the old socket this stops anything in the house working.

Each of the wires in the 2 cables are of a multi stranded type and there are only 2 red live ones of this type going into any of the fuse holders (they both go into the same fuse holder) in the fuseboard. Also the sleeving of the red wires at the old socket and fuseboard is a different shade of red to all the others. Hence my belief these 2 red wires at the fuseboard are the other ends of those in the old socket.

 

[dinoben]

The 2 red wires go into a 30 amp fuse holder & fuse at the fuseboard. Most of the power sockets in the house also go into it. So there are 3 wires going into it.

As to anything in the loft, not that I'm aware of. No alarm etc.

 

[stillp]

If for a particular circuit you disconnect the neutral wire at the fuseboard but not the live then current can still run in the live wire, but what about the other way round ie. when you disconnect the live but not the neutral can current run in the neutral.

Current doesn't flow in a single wire, but in a circuit. Usually the line and neutral form a circuit. If you disconnect one of the wires, voltage will still be present on the other one, and if something completes the circuit then current will flow, whether that 'something' is a wire, a fault, or a person.
Both line and neutral are considered to be 'live' wires.
You need to disconnect both.

 

[deadshort]

I would advise caution with this. What you describe is a socket on a ring circuit,two sets of cables ,30amp fuse. I would replace the socket and leave it in place.

Regards,

DS

 

[EFLImpudence]

The 2 red wires go into a 30 amp fuse holder & fuse at the fuseboard. Most of the power sockets in the house also go into it. So there are 3 wires going into it.

I would think that most of the power sockets in the house are not also anything - but are on these two cables and something else is also supplied from to the fuse.

 

[securespark]

Yes.

Sounds like a 60's/70's house where it was common to see the immersion on the first floor ring final.