Electric cooker supply cable.

[Agile]

I disconnect a lot of electric cookers so that I can connect up a gas cooker.

I would have expected that a 6 mm² flexible heat resisting cable should be used but I dont normally see these listed and all those I remove have been connected with flat twin + E cable which is intended for fixed wiring.

Whats the official line?

Tony


Edited to correct the very obvious error of showing 2 m² rather than 6 mm²

 

[Softus]

I would have expected that a 6 m² flexible heat resisting cable should be used

Are you trying to describe 6mm² flex?

Whats the official line?

The official line is that any DIY fiddling with electrics is always potentially dangerous.

 

[sparkyspike]

I would have expected that a 6 m² flexible heat resisting cable should be used

That will be flex then

connected with flat twin + E cable which is intended for fixed wiring.

Whats the official line?

flat twin and earth cable is intended for fixed wiring

 

[Softus]

a foolish and unhelpful post has been removed.

Methinks the correct word is "inserted".

 

[Agile]

Is there any polite ans sensible electrician who can comment on what I originally posted?

I have just looked in the Screwfix catalogue and not surprisingly find that the only 6 mm² cable listed is flat t & E.

Its probably not surprising that all the cookers I see have been fitted with T&E rather than the 6 mm² flexible !

In Electricians speak how naughty is this ?

I do have to say that I see it equally in HA flats where I would have expected standards to be higher.

Tony

 

[ericmark]

In most cases since cookers are moved very little and the terminal block is well out of the way of any heat there is no real problem.
521.9.2 does say it does not need to be flexible.
To look at a cable and know if thermosetting (90 deg) or thermoplastic (70 deg) would be hard. Thermosetting is often white and thermoplastic grey but you can't rely on the colours.
510.2 Is the main regulation in that manufactures recommendations should be adhered to.
With cookers often one never sees the paper work if when one does far too late I have noted that hobs for UK market arrive without flex but same hob for French market has four core flex with them.
Not sure why 4 core maybe double earth or split phase.
So no hard and fast rules but since a kitchen has to be registered under Part P I would not think the wrong cable gets fitted very often.
Eric

 

[Agile]

All very well saying that a kitchen has to be registered under Part P.

But equally so does any new gas connection. However, so many new kitchens are being installed and I only VERY rarely get called to connect hobe, perhaps once every two months if that!

The last one I had to walk away from because the hob was not fitted with FSD. Thery never called me back after getting the bright kind of hob so I expect the owner's father fitted it himself.

Tony

 

[ericmark]

CORGI to monitor the competency of those businesses and their operatives to undertake gas work safely and to investigate complaints against registered installers. And Landlords must arrange maintenance by a CORGI-registered installer.
As a private house holder I would be silly to DIY a gas appliance but not illegal only if I am a landlord or if it is connected to my businesses am I forced by law to use a Corgi registered person. There is no equivalent to Part P for gas where I can register the work I intend to undertake and get the LABC to check the work after.
With Corgi the person is registered and with Part P the firm is registered the system is completely different and the people policing the work are different too. The HSE are very different to the LABC. Also the general perception is different people think if they make a mistake they can smell gas. I know that CO and CO2 can’t be smelt but people don’t realise that and take silly chances. Also one is asked for completion certificates for electrical work when selling a house I do not recall ever seeing a gas appliance installation certificate and have not been asked for one with last house sale I was involved with. I don’t think you can really compare the two systems.
Eric

 

[Deleted member 18243]

The last one I had to walk away from because the hob was not fitted with FSD.

Tony

Please excuse my ignorance but what is FSD?

Thanks.

 

[securespark]

I would have expected that a 6 m² flexible heat resisting cable should be used

That will be flex then

Yes. Flex has a full title, which, if you are unaware of it is, "Flexible Cable"

As opposed to "Flexible Cord" which only goes up to 4mm².

So Agile was perfectly correct in what he wrote.


Agile, to answer your query: Yes, more often than not, cooking appliances are connected with standard T&E, unless supplied with a cable attached by the manufacturer, in which case this is likely to be flex and possibly HR too.

However, unless the manufacturer of an un-cabled appliance specifies a certain type of cable, then T&E is safe to use. In my experience, cooker terminal blocks don't suffer excessive temperature rises. The best thing if in doubt is to consult the manufacturer or their instructions.

See here: http://www.interpower.com/icl/images/HAR_Wire_coding-ICL.gif

 

[securespark]

a foolish and unhelpful post has been removed.

Methinks the correct word is "inserted".

Methinks you are a pompous fool.

 

[Softus]

Methinks you are a pompous fool.

That doesn't change the fact that I think you're a competent, genuine and well-meaning person.

 

[ricicle]

'Tis the season to be jolly, fa la la la la la la la la................

 

[radioredcat]

The last one I had to walk away from because the hob was not fitted with FSD.

Tony

Please excuse my ignorance but what is FSD?

Thanks.

An FSD (flame saftey device) and it's called by other names as well,What it does is cut the gas off if the flame goes out thats good isn't it.
If you buy a cooker for a flat it has to be an FSD compliant cooker,This reg came out jan this year but there was no suitable cookers available.
So whats the difference if you have a gas explosion in a flat or a house,The answer is simple more people are likely to be killed or injured where in a house your perfectly safe thats what the reg says to me it doesn't apply to houses or commercial premises.
Seems a bit stupid why not just make all cookers FSD compliant and then there's no confusion.


andy

 

[Agile]

The FSD actually stands for Flame Supervision Device!

Its required on all new cookers and hobs in flats or masonettes where another property is above or below.

I may be wrong but they may also be required on all cookers in rented properties as well.

The problem is that the retail sales industry has not really taken this on board and the gas industry has assumed that all cookers are fitted by CORGIs who will know. In reality only about a quarter of CORGIs do know althouth most doing gas safety checks do know.

My lady bought hers in Wickes web site where there was no indication of any problem. John Lewis is spot on though.

Tony