electrics to a wall tv

[barwickpaul]

hello i am planning on putting my tv on the wall and was wondering if it is ok to bring a spur off a double socket, up the wall and above my fireplace and connecting it to a fused box ?...one of these... www.screwfix.com/prods/17589/Electr...&cm_mmc=AffiliateWindow-_-DeepLink-_-Na-_-Na.

This was recommended to me from a man on a tv forum site,he also recommended that when i channel out the wall i cover the wires with a metal protection channelling.

Thanks

 

[ericmark]

Ugg! surface mount socket when the cable is to be concealed in a wall. I would use or if not already protected by RCD with of course a back box depending on type of wall.
As to metal capping this means the wall is then a wall of which includes metallic parts. I would use plastic oval conduit for retro fit. Needs less digging out of wall.
As to original socket is this part of a ring main? If so not too much of a problem but you can't take a spur off a spur.
If you intend to fit RCD at end of cable then you will need Ali-tube cable not twin and earth. I would fit a socket rather than fuse connection unit. Again standard if RCD already fitted and RCD one if not.

Basic facts since mid 2008 nearly all sockets need RCD protection and cables buried in walls unless using one of the special cables like Ali-tube need to also be protected by RCD is cable less than 50mm deep in wall.

In the main most TV's need SCART, TV, etc, etc, all plugged in and I had originally intended to wall mount mine until I realised how many cables needed to plug in. There are specials which have radio link for all but power.

 

[rebuke]

Also any buried cabling must be in safe zones (or buried at >50mm, which is generally impractical, or enclosed in earthed metal conduit (deep channels required), or SWA or whatever, but you're unlikely to do any of these) - you say it wants to go up the wall and above the fireplace - what exactly would your route be (can you draw a diagram in paint or something)?

If it's just going up from an existing socket, and then across to a new one, that's fine, as you'll get a vertical safe zone from the existing socket, and horizontal from the new...

 

[bernardgreen]

If the fire place has a working fire of any sort check the installation instructions for the TV. Mounting above a fire will affect the the TV by heat and dust carried by warm air rising into the TV . Some guarantees may be comprised if the TV is mounted over a fire place where there is a working fire.

 

[barwickpaul]

hi,thanks for the replies.
Bernard,i have an electric fire and the temp doesn't get anywhere near hot enough to affect the tv.

Ericmark,the socket is part of the ring main and the cable probably wouldn't go that far into the wall so i suppose a rcd type would be best,i didn't know you could get a socket with a rcd built in .Can i get alitube cable from b+q and whats the difference over twin and earth,is it just that its reinforced?

Rebuke i have tried doing a sketch using paint ,i want to route the wire(red line) from the socket upto a point just behind the tv on the wall which i haven't done as yet.
//www.diynot.com/network/barwickpaul/albums/

thanks Paul.

 

[rebuke]

What's the "Fire Switch" - is the fire electrical, and if so do you know where it is powered from, as if it's on the ring, then you might just be able to spur from the fire switch, and save yourself a little bit of cabling...

Otherwise your routes are OK, as long as the vertical is in line with the fire switch (it's slightly to the side in your drawing, which makes it out of a safe zone).

 

[barwickpaul]

Hi rebuke,the fire switch also has a fuse on it,i am not sure if it comes from the socket but it was in when we moved in 11 year ago,i recently bought a new electric fire ,so i just wired it to that.

I would have to go vertically up then to the right about at least 10 inches to hide it behind the tv.Forgive me but what is this safe zone?

Thanks Paul.

 

[rebuke]

Basically vertically above and below and horizontally to the left and right of any accessory (socket, switch etc) is a safe zone, where you are allowed to run cabling. The idea is to stop people accidentally drilling/nailing in to cabling - the presence of the accessory should indicate to someone to think twice about drilling/nailing in the safe zones from it, whereas if you run a cable outside of them, there's no indication to someone that there might be a cable there...

If the fire switch is a spur from the double socket, then you can't spur again from that, without putting in a separate 13A FCU to prevent the cable getting overloaded, if they're both on the ring, then I'd suggest you spur from the fire switch, as it's less cabling to do.

If I were you, I'd put in next to the fire switch a separate RCD FCU (assuming the ring isn't already RCD'd), and then run cable vertically straight up, and then across to a socket/cable outlet behind your TV - that would then do the trick...

 

[barwickpaul]

i know this is why you should get the professionals in ,i may ask my cousin to do it.How can you tell if a switch or socket is from the ring main or a spur,is it the amount of wires? I don't think the ring is rcd'd i don't have any trips in the garage they are the old black things with fuse wire running through the middle.
Is this what you mean regarding the rcd unit.
www.screwfix.com/prods/14770/Electrical-Supplies/RCDs/Powerbreaker-13A-RCD-FCU.

One more thing rebuke ,would you bury the wire in plastic conduit like ericmark suggested?

thanks Paul.

 

[ericmark]

The Ali-tube cable will need to come from an electrical whole sale outlet. As far as I am aware four makes BS 8436 cable Guardian, Earthshield, Flexishield, or Afumex all can be buried at less than 50mm without RCD protection for cable meaning you can use RCD socket like this click on image for more info.

The use of Ali-tube cable has been slow to take off. Most rewires will not require it as the consumer unit will have RCD protection but assuming not already protected by RCD Ali-tube will allow you to use just a RCD socket instead of a RCD FCU plus a socket.

However wires must still follow permitted routes. Vertical or Horizontal from visible item.

 

[BS3036]

I'm still puzzled how you are going to run all the other cables to your television. As an absolute minimum you need an aerial. But most people with flat screen TVs also have recorders / satellite boxes / etc. These will need connecting somehow, and if you don't have them now you may in the future.

I just had to install a wall mounted tv projector in my son's new room, and I have sunk a channel in the wall, 50mm wide, made from the back cut off a 50mm x 50mm conduit, and covered with a steel plate and then plastering mesh. So we can poke up any HDMI or whatever cable together with its connector, 'inside the wall'. But for this to work, it has to be a straight line.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I'm still puzzled how you are going to run all the other cables to your television. As an absolute minimum you need an aerial. But most people with flat screen TVs also have recorders / satellite boxes / etc. These will need connecting somehow, and if you don't have them now you may in the future.

I suspect the future is wireless.

Sony are doing it, and it seems such an attractive idea - no signal cables needed to the display - that it's gotta become widespread...

 

[bernardgreen]

that it's gotta become widespread...

Until so widespread that the available channels become saturated and interference from other people's equipment degrades the quality.

 

[ericmark]

I wonder how well they work when one also transmits on 70cm band I would wonder if 400W local transmission would be rejected?

TVI with a difference. Not even sure if you would have any redress as it is TV user who has unlicensed transmitter.

I have seen some really odd EMC problems with Police radio coming through on an electronic organ for example.

Hard enough with digital and analogue on same band where sky box or VCR interferes with Freeview. Add a second transmit and receive to that and every TV guy will need a spectrum analyser.

Can you see the problems with block of flats. Hard enough selecting a door bell frequency so you only answer your own door bell. Great fun with spare bell push and flicking through bands. Gives a whole new prospective to "Kinck Knock"?

 

[Steve]

Until so widespread that the available channels become saturated and interference from other people's equipment degrades the quality.

Like with mobile phones . . .