Everyones opinion of Part P

[RF Lighting]

If the 17th was made available more freely or a damn site cheaper then many more DIY'r would get a copy to work to it, paying £70 ish is too much for many to pay for a book

How many DIYers do you think are going to understand what is written in the big red book?

I had to study it at college to even get a basic understanding of what it says, and its implications in the real world.

 

[mattylad]

There are many DIY'rs that will understand whats written in that big red book.

Despite your repeated implications, not all DIYrs are stupid.
Some can manage to read & understand books like this.

When a government document relies on BS7671 as much as the approved doc P, IMO the BS relied upon should be more easily made available to the general public.

Other than that it's just another case of the old boys club

 

[ericmark]

I am sure you can read the big red book in a reference library. But you can't take the book home. As a result in order to take the C&G 2382 you need to have the book with you in exam and I took mine at same time as my son so I had to buy two big red books.

Cheapest way was to join IET as student member and then buy books from them. Plus I get all membership as well.

As to the college teaching one about the big red book well I can read book myself without having someone reading it for me. The practice questions help and so does advice on which bits to concentrate on. But how it is ever classed as level 3 exam I don't know.

As to all DIY people being stupid well of course not. I go to a radio club every week and I am the only one with C&G 2382 and 2391 but they are all very clued up some with degrees in electrical subjects. And when the explain how to correctly terminate a supply taking into account the impedance of the conductors it does make the electrics used in a house look rather simplistic.

And I have to admit it seems we are returning to the times when my dad was a boy. He tells me of how when he was de-mobbed he was able to go to the steel works where he had never worked before and insist that a dilutee was removed from the job he had served an apprenticeship to learn even though the guy had been doing that job for 4 years.
Being thrown out of the union in a closed shop meant you lost your job. The conservatives much to my fathers disgust broke the unions and made it so people could change trades and basically if you could do the job you could be employed to do it.
Why should anyone be surprised that when the Labour party got into power they would not try to return things to how they were? OK different name for club no longer called electricians and plumbers union but Corgi and NICEIC but it amounts to same thing.

So if you don't like it complain to your MP. If you still don't like it show it with your vote. But you can complain on here to cows come home with no avail. I am not saying complaining to MP will make much difference but if enough complain may be it will?

 

[JonoPashley]

Big Red Book is written in a form that would be used for laws etc which makes it harder to understand hense why they produce the osg which is put in a easier to understand style of language

 

[mattylad]

Yes but to be completely correct you also need the BRB

Don't get me wrong, I'm not objecting to part P & its requirements, I'm just saying that if "they" want even DIY''r to work to it then it ought to be more readily available.

Although I do object to the massive fees the LABC's are charging for simple things.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

But how it is ever classed as level 3 exam I don't know.

Level 1: You know your name.
Level 2: You know your name and you can find your way to the examination centre.
Level 3: You know your name and you can find your way to the examination centre and then home again afterwards.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not objecting to part P & its requirements, I'm just saying that if "they" want even DIY''r to work to it then it ought to be more readily available.

Why draw the line at electrical reference material? It's only one out of 14 parts - I'm sure that all the documentation and standards documents that are needed to enable compliance with the other 13 should also be made available at the taxpayer's expense so that people can carry out controlled work without having to make an investment themselves in finding out how to do it properly.

 

[ericmark]

BAS sad to say but your level thing is about right. But how a 2391 is same level as 2382 I have yet to work out.

I only got to Level 5 maybe if I do Level 6 (Hons Deg) it will become plan?

I do agree that the rules should be more freely available. When I did one of the courses it kept referring to GS 38 and it took a lot of doing but in the end I did get a copy. Seems it costs just £2 First published 1986 Revised 1991 but as to if still up to date not a clue.

And that is the problem we still have people quoting regulations which died with 15th Edition distance from sink and cooker for outlets and switches.

I am sure in 5 years time we will still get people saying RCD's are only required for circuits outside or you need to bond everything in a bathroom. The internet does not help as there are so many old pages around. I have lost access to some of my old web pages, there is no way I can modify or delete pages and I am sure I am not the only one to move ISP and lose access to web pages. And there is not a date on them.

Welcome to the misinformation highway!!!!!!!

 

[ban-all-sheds]

And there is not a date on them.

And last time I checked Amazon UK were selling domestic wiring guides written for the US market.

Caveat lector.....