Evil artex! WTF!

[trowelmonkey1]

Hello boys,

Had my first bad job this week, was for a mate in Brum, had 2 ceilings he wanted skimming, too far to go and see the job but had him email me pics.

anyway, rolled up with bonding and multi in the van and inspected ceilings, he had painted them with a shiny trade undercoat, sprayed some water on it and water stayed there for about half hour so i deemed the suction 'no problem' his girlfriend then preceded to tell me how all the ceilings in the house were done with the same artex and that normally within an hour of painting the paint flakes off in sheets!

i inspected some of this under the stairs and the artx was..well, chalky in places and soft like putty in others it's been on for years and was never painted by the builders.

so back to the ceilings, was a really shallow pattern so decided to apply a tack coat of PVA and skim the smaller of the 2 and see how it went, it went! and quite quickly, worked like a maniac but still couldn't quite get it flat in time, re-skimmed next morning and looked good so went onto the bigger ceiling...

based on the how the previous ceiling went i applied a tight coat of bonding then skimmed it, got 2 thirds on and wen back to start flattening out when i hit a LARGE bubble, realised the artex must have given up it's bond DOH! avoided the area with the plan to get the rest of the ceiling done and cut out the failed part and patch it, anyway and here's the fun part! went to mix up another bucket full started laying it on and...rip thud! a sheet of plaster came down, including artex, then another bigger sheet, about a metre square.

i stopped doing anything at this point and cleaned up.

WHAT IS THIS ARTEX STUFF I CHANCED UPON!?!?!

 

[Alastairreid]

commiserations tm, welcome to the club i dont profess to know the chemical components of artex though i do know the stuff you refer to.

maybe richard c aint far off the mark removing artex before plastering after all.

if the artex was parting company with the substrate when introduced to moisture from the bonding +skim theres no amount of pva or any other remedial works you could realisticaly have done to prevent this.

the only solution imo would have been to either remove the gunk if possible or overboard.

of course hindsights a great thing.

betcha this was mates rates as well

keep the faith tm

 

[trowelmonkey1]

thanks alastair! i'm honoured

was mates rates yes! but every job is a learning opportunity at the moment and he's paid for the work so far as he knows it's not my fault.

he didn't want to remove artex because of the mess so skimming was what he wanted doing, he'll be regretting that now and a t least i can now say to customers i've seen it happen.

i've suggested to him that i fill the holes with bonding to level the ceilign and overboard it, will save him making a right mess! he's thinking on it and paying for me to go back week after next to do it so all not lost.

i can see how a steamer would get the stuff off though but would be a pig of a job.

 

[joe-90]

Well my advice is to walk away. You are way too far from base to do 'mates rates' on a ceiling that the owner KNOWS is dodgy. Give him his money back and if he's a decent bloke he'll cover your costs so far.

It's a job for a local crew. Someone just around the corner - not across the country.

When it comes to boarding out was there coving or fancy plaster around the light? If it's a newer build was the ceiling concrete?

It's just not worth your while. If you back out they'll understand why.

You did your best anticipating a one day turn around.

You'll get bogged down if you persevere.

That's my take on it anyway.

 

[trowelmonkey1]

thanks for your view joe!

to be honest the rate is barely mates rates

no coving or anything fancy so overboarding would be a straight forward job, and as i'm a brummie i get to see family or mates for a drink when i'm up that way, only reason i do work that far away from home, and only fit it in if i'm not busy with anything else, i'll see what he comes back with and quote him a fair price to do it and if he wants a local to finish it he's welcome to.

i get the feeling i have to be carefult with mates rates jobs, especially when i get really busy.

 

[joe-90]

I abolished mates rates years ago. Offer a fair price and do a good job. If that's not good enough for them let them go elsewhere. I don't expect mates rates in return. I 'd rather we charged each other a fair price.

 

[Alastairreid]

i get the feeling i have to be carefult with mates rates jobs, especially when i get really busy.

mates and relatives are the bain of my life trowelmonkey

just a wee job wont take you long, always without fail ends up a big job costing me money and grief.

example......... and this is exactly what happened 2yrs ago........sister who lives 40 miles away requests i build her a 12m x1m retaining wall in her back garden, ok says i 1 week and 300 miles of gridlocked m way driving later job done...then.....the tatty wooden garage makes her nice new curved f/brick wall look bad......3 weeks and i new single leaf r/casted,flat roofed garage incorporating upvc side door, 1 dg unit and electric up and over door.........then she wants patio doors installed to the house to access her new back garden.............then the best part..6 months later phone goes same sis.....can you build me a garage and retile my roof in the new house i have bought across the rd.

yup i'm rained off today

 

[trowelmonkey1]

blimey! that's a severe case Alastair!

i'm already considering stopping birmingham work! especially now after reading that!

i agree with you joe, i think a fair price and peace of mind that they aren't going to get ripped off and will get a decent job should be plenty!

annoying thinking about it, i purposely don't ask my mates to do anything for me as i don't want to put on them and be a cause of their grief etc. much rather get a local boy in for my jobs.

sunny down here Alastair! you must get rained off a fair bit up there?

 

[Alastairreid]

sunny down here Alastair! you must get rained off a fair bit up there?

yeah! probably not as much as our friend roughcaster though!

by the way i did go back and tile the roof of her new house thats her roof in my profile pics, and build another garage for her mates or in this case sisters rates.

who needs to advertise with a family like mine.

ah well its good to be needed i suppose

 

[trowelmonkey1]

hmmm a little more than just a plasterer me thinks!

yeah RC is way north, doesn't it stay dark for 6 months of the year up there?

 

[Micilin]

You need to seal up artex the day before to stop the risk of moisture getting in and making it peel off - taking a short cut here can lead to problems. (of course any loose stuff shoulf come off first)

You'll just have to put it down to experience. PVA applied as a coat the same day invariably does not seal up , and also will not stop suction on high suction backgrounds. It has two purposes , it needs to be set properly to seal, and to be tacky to act as a glue.

I can see how bad artex would be powdery, but for it to be soft like putty after years , suggests it is still damp, which is puzzling.

 

[trowelmonkey1]

Hi Micilin!

thx for your input, and it makes sense completely, i think i may have twigged if the suction seemed none existent in the first place, then again maybe i wouldn't, who knows now, but like i say it seemed like the paint he'd used pretty much sealed it, OBVIOUSLY not though.

as to what the artex is...strange indeed, was certainly still moist in parts, but has been there since the house was built, late 80's early 90's maybe, all on plasterboard ceilings, house seems sound so no idea what the problem is, never seen artex like it! and suspect that the areas that fell off may have been putty like areas, kitchen was fine.

 

[Micilin]

suspect that the areas that fell off may have been putty like areas, kitchen was fine.

Was under the stairs (or where like putty ) where there is a boiler, or maybe anything to cause condensation? Were the walls damp?

It's an odd one .

 

[trowelmonkey1]

the area under the stairs where i found the putty like stuff was just a store for the fridge and some food stuffs, didn't smell at all damp in there.

so you think the artex was normal/standard stuff despite it being so chalky/soft?

picture for your general amusement, was just staring to flatten out from the window and came across large bubbles! guess where abouts they were!

Untitled

• trowelmonkey1
• 14 Aug 2009
• 1

 

[Alastairreid]

oh well at least the suns shining down there