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Filling an external 20mm gap between window and brickwork

Discussion in 'Windows and Doors' started by RobinClay, 6 Oct 2012.

  1. RobinClay

    RobinClay

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    They've made us some nice new hardwood windows to replace the uPVC, but there's a 20mm gap between frame and brickwork. These gaps are filled mostly with foam, but how should I seal them on the outside against the weather?

    I thought of using lime mortar, but that would a) crack, and b) not be weather-proof.

    I thought of using a gunned sealant, but the gap is so wide a) it would use an awful lot, and b) it would look terrible!

    What would YOU do?
     
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  3. gregers

    gregers

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    er are you saying a firm has fitted you windows and left you with gaps???
    tell them to come back and finish the bloody job theyve been paid for.

    3/4 or 1 " quad will close the gaps nicely.then silicone the back of the quad to the brickwork.
     
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  4. RobinClay

    RobinClay

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    Yes. They are joiners, not window fitters.
    Well - not exactly... They haven't been paid in full yet ;) They did a great deal more than expected, and I said I would finish off the making good. One wall was previously uPVC-clad; when they came to measure up, the battens were still in place; we were planning to re-clad in timber. The other wall was rendered & painted, and I've stripped that off. With it came the reveal, for the opening was previously that much bigger.

    Thanks for that suggestion. Alas! Two of the windows are flush with the face of the wall.
     
  5. gregers

    gregers

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    Quote:
    3/4 or 1" quad will close the gaps nicely.then silicone the back of the quad to the brickwork.
    Thanks for that suggestion. Alas! Two of the windows are flush with the face of the wall.

    Read more: http://www.diynot.com/forums/window...en-window-and-brickwork.339702/#ixzz28YjrL1pw

    then either use some small architrave or a profile that isnt too intrusive,but bear in mind whatever you use make sure it matches throughout.
     
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  6. RobinClay

    RobinClay

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    Thank you for your response.

     
  7. crank39

    crank39

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    I'm sorry but with the way you've described it there seems to be no easy way to fill of cloak those gap without it looking like a dogs dinner.

    Furthermore, 20mm is unaceptable, you say that the edges were hidden behind render and pvc cladding, i say so what, they should of eased the cladding away and chipped a bit of render off to find the edge of the existing frames; if your making bespoke hardwood frames (which no doubt aren't cheap) then you need to make sure you measure them right, its not like an off the shelf standard sized window from magnet that you can take back.

    Bet the were over the moon when you told them you'd finish them off, bet they were scratching their heads as to how they would finish them, seems you did them a favour :oops:
     
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  8. Harbourwoodwork

    Harbourwoodwork

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  9. gregers

    gregers

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    still think you need to get them back.
    even if its to say to them,HOW ON EARTH AM I MEANT TO MAKE A SILK PURSE OUT OF A SOWS EAR.

    joiners do not normally do an inferior job,they on the other hand normally exceed the jobs requirements.
     
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  11. joe-90

    joe-90

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    These must be windows that were sitting around the workshop. Tell them to come and replace them or the small claims court beckons.
     
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  12. RobinClay

    RobinClay

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    They have done a first class joinery job, and we are very pleased with the windows. Of the 14, eight were straightforward. Tthree we are not entirely happy with:- They replaced Crittall windows, and they made too big a rebate on the inside, so had to close it with a hardwood trim; also, they are flush with the outside of the wall, rather than (which we would have preferred) being inset. But we can live with these.

    And then there are these other three windows. Two were set into a painted rendered wall; the third, the wall had been clad in uPVC.

    I told them I would be taking the render off to see what lay beneath. In the event (after they had made the windows) I took the render off and found a brick (soft bricks!) corner pillar to flint walls. The render was VERY hard cement render, which is why the walls were VERY damp. When I took the render off, many of the flints came too - it was rather scary ! They were held in by very crumbly lime mortar (well, sand, truth be told - scratch it, and it comes away) with deep and extensive voids.

    When I took the render off round the windows, I found that there had been a previous window a couple of inches wider, with another rendered reveal on each side.

    So I don't blame the joiners there. I'm making a new arris of strong lime mortar (NHL 5, 2:1) which I shall "point" to give an ashlar effect - it's all going to be painted.

    The other window - a very wide one - in the 9" brickwork gable wall was aluminium-framed, with 1" thick hardwood reveals internally, and a 1" thick hardwood soffit. But when I stripped off the cladding battens on the outside, I found that this hardwood formed a frame around the aluminium frame. In the loft still remains a chimney, demolished below ceiling level (and I think totally unsupported save by the corbel effect), which originally served a fireplace on the ground floor, and was cut out to make way for the window.

    Wait for it !

    Upon removing the cladding battens, I discovered that the concrete lintel was the same length as the top of the hardwood frame, i.e. it did not extend into the brickwork at all ! So the hardwood frame was holding the lintel and the brickwork above it, including the old chimney ! Scary, or what !

    So our joiners acquired a longer concrete lintel from a demolition site, removed the short one and installed the longer one. They also removed the ali window, and the hardwood reveal and the hardwood soffit, revealing two side-by-side 4 x 2 lintels holding the inner skin - and at least these were properly set into the brickwork on each side!

    Their price was for supplying, painting and installing the windows, with an extra item for:-
    Take out and dispose of existing units, replace with new units. Every care will be taken to minimise plaster damage, however, we can't be held responsible for the plaster failing or crumbling. - FITTING £2,495.00

    Oh, and they also made and installed a new timber conservatory, and demolished the old one. We are very pleased with that, too.

    And there were a few "extras" there as well, for which they didn't charge.

    Total works about £30,000.... work required by the Council to replace unauthorised work to a Listed Building, done by previous owners.

    AND... we have been assured it will still be VAT zero-rated !

    I'll see if I can post some pix...
     
  13. gregers

    gregers

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    i think in this situation to give us all a chance of giving you the best advice or just to give us a bloody good laff ;) then a few piccys of said work will do us all wonders.
     
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  14. crank39

    crank39

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    Sounds like they had a lot on but i still say theres no excuse for not chopping render back or pulling a bit of cladding off to get the correct size.

    Also you mention 'listed building' :eek:, wonder what your BCO or preservation officer will say when they see these flush fitting windows and how you propose finishing them off?
     
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  15. RobinClay

    RobinClay

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    Gable window.

    Before:-
    __
    Capped chimney in loft, over window

    Cladding removed:-
    Note short lintel - click on pic for enlarged version

    ________
    LH end of Lintel _____________________________ RH end of Lintel


    After, showing gaps between window frame and structure:-
    New Lintel, with gap beneath

    ----
    LH Side _________________________________RH Side
    Foamfill scraped back to form a deeper recess.
     
  16. RobinClay

    RobinClay

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    O.K., so you've all had a good laugh

    But it's not reeeelly that funny :(

    Any suggestions as to the best way to fill those gaps ?
     
  17. joe-90

    joe-90

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    I'd call the sheriff if I were you. They've made the new windows from measurements from the old ones.
     
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