They my well have to if regulations/laws changed to require, say, a minimum tread depth which new Michelin tyres had but which the Nexen ones fitted in the factory didn't.
Kind Regards, John
Garage RCD Intermittant Tripping
- Thread starter Olivias Grumpy
- Start date
Kind Regards, John
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Designed for loads in which the current flow is an AC sinewave, which 30+ years ago was almost everything.
Today it's almost nothing.
It's safe to use in the situations it was designed for.
The outcome when using it in other situations is undefined.
Also obsolete, which is not surprising as although most other countries stopped using Type AC RCDs decades ago, the UK for reasons unknown continued to allow such things until very recently.
Hi
So it’s obsolete in manufacture?
But not unsafe to use or replace like for like?
It’s in a garage that has 8 sockets
6 lights on 2 switches
And 2 external security pir lights
Unless it becomes mandatory , no further action required
So it’s obsolete in manufacture?
But not unsafe to use or replace like for like?
It’s in a garage that has 8 sockets
6 lights on 2 switches
And 2 external security pir lights
Unless it becomes mandatory , no further action required
Obsolete in terms of the requirements of the Wiring Regulations for newly-installed components. The regulations do not retrospectively apply to components already in service before the latest requirement came into force (which, co-incidentally, was a couple of days ago, on 27th September).
The Wiring Regulations are not mandatory. However, in coming to a conclusion about acceptability, bodies such as Local Authority Building Control departments and,, theoretically ultimately, Courts will look to the Wiring Regulations for guidance, and it would be difficult for anyone, even an 'expert', to justify something that was not compliant with the current Wiring Regs.
I have no doubt that some people will continue to install Type AC RCDs, but that does not make it 'right', nor compliant with the prevailing regulations.
Kind Regards, John
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Really! Do you consider cigarettes safe? I know B & Q don’t sell them but many so called reputable shops and supermarkets do.
Hi
No I don’t consider cigarettes safe.
However until legislation changes and cigarettes are banned, they will be sold.
Question. Do you consider AC RCDs unsafe?
I will accept that you wouldn’t install one in a new install. However does that mean every home, building etc that has them fitted, is now unsafe?
Regards Kelwyn
That's an almost philosophical question which we often debate here.
The simple, and obvious, answer is that they are no less safe then they were when they were installed or at any time subsequently.
However, views as to what is 'safe', even legal, change over time. For a start, in context, there was a time when electrical installations without any RCDs were considered safe enough to be allowed, and the requirement for them in relation to various types of circuit has only gradually increased over many years - so there have been plenty of times in recent years when the absence of RCD protection for some circuit was considered 'safe enough' then, but not now.
More generally, in my youth, any number of electrical things which would today be considered 'totally unsafe' were very widely deployed, hence presumably regarded as 'adequately safe' at the time (e.g. light switched whose covers could easily be unscrewed by hand, revealing life parts, but many many more examples. The first car I owned was considered 'adequately safe for the time', even though it did not have, or even have provision for, seat belts.
For me, personally, this issue of Type AC RCDs is even more difficult because, as I have said very many times, I have yet to succeed in finding enough 'chapter and verse' to convince me that they really are a significant problem with them (hence 'unsafe' by today's standards). Although that means that I remain a bit sceptical, I nevertheless accept what the regulations now require and hence, as you have seen, 'defend' that situation.
Even more generally, there are plenty of laws that I don't really agree with, but am obliged to comply with!
Kind Regards, John
Thanks John
I totally accept that safety is paramount.
Just out of interest I had quick look on Screwfix and was surprised to note that they sell populated consumer units. Some with AC and some others with Type A rcds
I assume the type A is now the preferred choice for most domestic installs?
Regards
I totally accept that safety is paramount.
Just out of interest I had quick look on Screwfix and was surprised to note that they sell populated consumer units. Some with AC and some others with Type A rcds
I assume the type A is now the preferred choice for most domestic installs?
Regards
I hope we all do. However, as I just wrote, one has to remember that 'safe'/'safety' is not an absolute - but, rather, is a matter of the prevailing opinions (of individuals, or society as a whole). Something which is considered 'safe' (or 'safe enough') today may not still be considered to be 'safe enough' next year (or even 'tomorrow'. My father spent his entire adult life driving, but never had to take a driving test. Society would not consider that to be 'safe' today.
There appear to still be a lot of Type ACs being sold, either individually or within populated CUs, and I suspect that will continue to be the case for quite a long time (probably as long as they are being manufactured). In the UK I don't think there is any mechanism whereby their sale could be 'forbidden' because what the (non-mandatory) Wiring Regs say.
Yes. In fact, rather more than 'preferred' for new installs since, in order to be compliant with the (albeit non-mandatory) Wiring Regs (aka BS 7671), for most circuits only Type A (or 'better') is acceptable.
Kind Regards, John
So why did you fit a Type AC In your shed? OH yes 2 quid
I don't think that logic or common sense is necessarily meant to come into any of this, but (although I may be wrong) I would rather doubt that, in reality, (m)any of the loads likely to be fed from sockets in a garage would be likely to be such as to be a problem for a Type AC RCD - and certainly unlikley to be any more 'potentially problematic' loads fed from those sockets than were being fed in that manner a few years ago.
Kind Regards, John
Still a no no
No it wasn’t cos it was £2!!
It was because it was the same spec as the original AND I wasn’t convinced it was the root cause of the fault, but it had to be eliminated.
As it happens the fault hasn’t been cured. So now I have proven it isn’t the RCD and I need to look elsewhere. AND I didn’t spend £25+ in vain.
Onwards and upwards
What is ?
Still non-compliant with current BS 7671 - which, as I've said to the OP is why I cannot advise him other than to 'comply'
Kind Regards, John
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