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Individual radiators' Control?

Discussion in 'Plumbing and Central Heating' started by Clueless87, 15 Jun 2019.

  1. Clueless87

    Clueless87

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    Hi there,

    I just moved into my new property and I have realised how different the heating system seems to be compared to what I am familiar with.

    So, previously I had heaters 'dials' on every single one of them, where I could put them on and off to different temperatures. Now however it seems to be controlled by a thermostat and only some of the heaters have the dial thing on them (and for some reason, on these heaters is on the top, not at the bottom. I will upload pictures at the bottom because I know I am not that great at explanations, sorry).

    My main problem is, I need just one or 2 rooms to be good temperature at all times, the rest such as the hallways, frontroom, kitchen and stuff it's not really needed, yet now with this thermostat system if I put the temperature up to get the rooms toastie, I will make the whole house warm and consume a lot of unneeded gas.

    I am not a DIY person at all but I would like to hear what options I have before calling someone please? Is there a way to install those dials to the heaters that don't have it or any other way to make sure that the bedrooms are of a certain temperature and the rest of the house is not?

    Any help would be highly appreciated, thank you for reading this.

    Pictures:

    The heaters with the dial in this house:

    [​IMG]

    Don't know why the dial is up, I always used to have it down but I guess it's still okay?

    [​IMG]

    The heaters without dial:

    [​IMG]

    Can I turn it off or lower it from here somehow?

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: 15 Jun 2019
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  3. JohnD

    JohnD

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    please show us your timer/programmer and your wall thermostat, if any

    the dial on the radiator knob is a thermostatic radiator valve. It turns the radiator down, then off, when the room reaches the pre-set temperature.

    If the room is colder than the setting, the radiator will be on.

    Turning the setting up does not make the room heat any faster.

    I see one of yours is set to 6. This is too hot. Try it on 3 or 4. Close the room door or the heat will escape from that room.

    Rooms that you do not want heated can be turned to 1 or 2. The radiator will only come on if the room gets quite chilly.

    The radiator that has no TRV is probably in the room with the wall stat. This is correct. Do not turn it off.
     
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  4. Hello Clueless87,

    Good explanation above. Yes you can have these dials - Thermostatic radiator valves (TRV’s) on all radiators and shouldn’t be that much of a job to install. What you have on the other one is called a lockshield valve designed to be used when balancing the system by your installer. You may have wheelhead valves on other radiators which are adjustable.

    Your TRV on the photo is just one way of installing them.
     
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  5. Madrab

    Madrab

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    Are you renting? You may need to have a chat with the landlord to get it all sorted out. You will be able to shut off the radiators that you don't need so they don't heat up but if they don't have thermostatic valves on them you will need to use a small adjustable spanner to manually turn one of the radiator valves off.
     
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  6. JohnD

    JohnD

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    Or the knob.
     
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  7. Clueless87

    Clueless87

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    Thank you both JohnD and undertrained.

    The pictures of the thermostat and timer (which I cannot understand how to work either, I mean I know how it works but I can't seem to take neither 1 2 3 or 4 off) as requested:

    Thermostat in the Hallway near the entrance:

    [​IMG]

    Timer near the Boiler in the bedroom (the one with TRV installed):

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    @JohnD The thermostat is in the hallway at the entrance and yes that is correct, the heater without the TRV (one of them at least) is there. However the one in the kitchen also does not have it as well as another one in the bedroom, which are all those ones that I idealistically want off (or at 1 like you suggested). To do so would I need to buy a TRV for them or is it possible to turn them off in any other way, like by switching the valve in this picture?

    [​IMG]
    You are right, one was set at 6 because I was trying them out, I normally don't go over 3 or at least I didn't in the previous house :) I however did think that putting the dial on a higher number was going to make the room hot quicker so thank you for informing me that it's not the case.

    So, regarding the heater in the hallway where the thermostat is, should I just leave it? Because that being in the hallway near the front entrance I think will mean that it will be constantly on and use up a lot of gas. Sorry to be a pain I just have no clue about radiators or anything plumbing related.

    @undertrained That's a relief thanks. Going back to the question for John above, is it just a matter of buying dials and sticking them on on the end? If it's an easy enough job me and my partner might be able to learn but if it's more complicated than that I might need to call someone.

    Again thank you both so much for your help :)
     
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  8. JohnD

    JohnD

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    the little plastic knob on the top corner of your rad is to bleed gas out, if it gets any. You will know because the bottom of the radiator will be hot and the top cold. It does not turn the rad off.

    Your rads without TRVs will probably mostly have a valve at one end with a knob that you can use to turn them off.

    The "dial" is a TRV or Thermostatic Radiator Valve.

    This is a particularly good one
    https://www.screwfix.com/p/danfoss-ras-c-white-chrome-angled-trv-15mm-x/70871

    But your old valves may have a makers name printed or moulded on the plastic cap. Don't buy any new ones until you are sure they are the exact dimensions of your old ones, or your pipes have enough wobble room to fit them. Pipes that come up through floorboards or down through ceilings are usually a bit slack, pipes in concrete floors or brick walls, usually not.

    Your timer has probably gone stiff through lack of use. The little plastic tabs can be pushed out (away from the centre) to release the teeth, then round to the start/stop times you want. This will be more economical than leaving it on 24hr constant.

    It is a rebadged ACL Drayton SM1, sold under contract by British Gas and Scottish Gas with their name on it.

    https://www.draytoncontrols.co.uk/product/sm1

    Very simple and easy to use.

    The stat is also an ACL Drayton, very simple and easy to use, a good brand, practically nothing to go wrong. You can get a more complicated one if you want. If you get a wireless one it will go wrong more often.

    p.s.
    Putting the thermostat in the hall used to be popular in the 1950's. Apparently people used to turn it down when they went out. It is more sensible to have it in the main living room that you use most often, since that is the room where you most appreciate a comfortable temperature. You can have one put in a different room but it will mean running a new cable so is best done just before you redecorate the room. In some cases it can be done by drilling a hole through the wall where the old one is, and poking the wire through the hole into the next room. Cables are usually run under the floor but can go along skirtings.

    it's true about wireless controls going wrong more often.
     
    Last edited: 15 Jun 2019
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  9. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

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    bleed air out.

    I know air is a gas but don't want people to think gas from the boiler can make its way to the radiator.
     
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  11. JohnD

    JohnD

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    apart from the day you first fill the radiators with water, the stuff that comes out is not air. It is usually hydrogen which is a byproduct of the corrosion of the iron in the radiators with water.

    Something like Fe + H2O => FeO + H2
    or Fe2O3 + H6

    But as you say, it is not the gas from the gaspipes.
     
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  12. ianmcd

    ianmcd

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    yes I noticed that too, however it may not be air that is at the top of the radiator it could be hydrogen gas, so technically it is not wrong to say gas, should have read Air/hydrogen gas due to build up of bacteria in a dirty system
     
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  13. upload_2019-6-15_16-9-58.jpeg

    As @JohnD has said, this is a bleed vent, which allows the trapped air/hydrogen out and replaced with water. Also as stated, yes the hallway rad can stay the same, as in no TRVs. If you want TRVs to all other rads, you can’t just stick dials on them, system needs to be partially drained and whole new valves fitted. If you don’t like the look of the one in the very first pic (trv at the top) then change this at the same time.

    However as @Madrab asked, is this rented?
     
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  14. Madrab

    Madrab

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    By the looks of it they are both lockshields with blank caps
     
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  15. Clueless87

    Clueless87

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    Sorry Madrab I think your reply came as I was replying to the previous 2 messages and I missed it :( Thank you for commenting and to respond to the question, no the house has been bought, I just moved in 2 days ago :)

    @JohnD Yeah the timer does seem stiff, I was just afraid of breaking it when trying to push out the teeth. I got the instructions now from the website you sent me and am using that to understand it all.

    Thank you for mentioning the problems of wireless thermostats, I will make sure to stay away from those. To be honest I don't really mind the one that I got now, it seems straightforward to use. I just want to be able to put the heaters off or on low settings in the rooms where it's not required. Also, thank you for showing me the TRV from screwfix, that's exactly the one I had in my previous house and I liked them a lot.

    The house was built during the 50-70s I believe so that makes a lot of sense, I will search a plumber in the area and ask them about moving the thermostat to either the front room or the bedroom if possible.

    I'll let you all know what was said by the plumber as soon as I manage to get one in :)
     
  16. ianmcd

    ianmcd

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    If you say where in the country you are someone on here may be able to recommend someone
     
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  17. D_Hailsham

    D_Hailsham

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    It's not possible to put a head ("dial") on a standard valve as they work in completely differentl ways. A standard valve is turned to open or close, like a tap; on a TRV the head mechanism pushes a pin up/down in the metal valve body. You will have to buy a complete TRV as shown in the screwfix catalogue. This is really a job for someone with experience as it requires the system to be drained down.
     
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