INTERNAL REWIRING AND STORAGE HEATERS

[ashtonvillageuk]

Hello.......am considering purchasing a property which is about 30 yrs old, am rather concerned that the internal wiring will not be up to scratch, the property had a major refurb in 2004 but was not rewired, should I be concerned over the state of the wiring ?

The property also has night storage heaters, is there any way these can be tested to see if they are 100% efficent ?

Many thanks,

Steve

 

[Chri5]

If the wiring is as old as you suggest then it's likely to need major attention, try to factor in a discount on the purchase cost to allow for the works 50:50.

So if the full rewire is £4k, suggest a £2k offset.

Best way forward is a PIR via an electrician which is a periodical inspection report, average cost £150 which can be used as a beating stick against the purchaser. It will give factual detail on defects and codes detailing the urgency of work.

As for night storage, 30 year old ones will be inefficient- modern ones are better, but I'd suggest you consider a wet ch system as a better alternative.

 

[SUNRAY]

Isn't a PIR supposed to be done by the seller these days?

 

[ColJack]

no requirement in the HIP anymore.. they took it out..
however, most buyers will ask for one if for no other reason to try and get a bit knocked off the price...

as said, no heating system is 100% efficient.. and storage is not great to start with.. you have to anticipate your needs the night before..

if you have access to gas then a combi boiler would be better with rads, or failing that you can get electric boilers for radiators..

 

[SUNRAY]

no requirement in the HIP anymore.. they took it out.. ..

Any idea when? A friend is trying to sell at the moment and was told the 6 year old PIR was not good enough and estate agent got one done without asking and is now trying to charge £700 for it.

 

[flameport]

The requirement for a PIR (and several other things) was in the original proposals for the HIP, but all of the semi-useful content was removed before they were introduced.
Now all you get is a useless 'energy report', most of which could be easily determined just by looking at the building.

£700 for a PIR on a domestic property - not likely. That would equate to the PIR taking several full days to complete.

 

[Chri5]

no requirement in the HIP anymore.. they took it out.. ..

Any idea when? A friend is trying to sell at the moment and was told the 6 year old PIR was not good enough and estate agent got one done without asking and is now trying to charge £700 for it.

The only time a PIR is necessary is for landlord property safety, all domestic premises are 'advised' to have 1 x PIR at a 10 year frequency. That can be reduced by the reporting person due to a consideration that 'issues' may warrant less than a 10 year gap between inspection frequency.

If the property has no history, no paperwork such as EIC's or MWC for work done in the last (since 05) 4/5 years a PIR is sensible.

If the property wiring looks poor, has older fittings, old sleeve on wiring, wired fuse carriers, no main earth bonding (gas + water) then a PIR is essentially a report and beating stick to get the price reduced or some form of gesture from the property owner.

A sort of MOT for the electrics, the purchaser can then decide if the property is right for them. Some rewires are major grief regarding fabric damage, plaster repairs, lifting laminate or sold flooring systems etc.

A full rewire in a 4 bed might cost £5k and still require major redecoration and fabric repair.

As for £700 for a PIR, well only if its something like a castle with 30 rooms. 3 phase, out buildings and a swimming pool.

 

[sparkwright]

get a pir done. it may not need rewiring. 2.5 solid cables generally suggest all is well. if you're lucky you might just need remedial work done, which will probably include earthing and new consumer unit.

 

[flameport]

The property also has night storage heaters, is there any way these can be tested to see if they are 100% efficent ?

All electric heaters are 100% efficient at the point of use. All of the energy input is converted to heat.

Storage heaters either work or they don't. If they don't, most can be repaired for a minimal cost.
Not really any point in replacing old storage heaters with new ones either, they won't be any better, unless the old ones were the wrong size.

 

[SUNRAY]

I thought £700 was too steep and advised them not to pay especially as the estate agents had done this without consultation, the first they knew was when they came home from holiday early July and the bill was in the pile of post waiting for them.

I haven't seen the paperwork, apparently it consists of 17 pages

The bill is made up of 1 day for 2 people at £265, £10 certificate fee and £45 admin plus VAT making a total of £572.75.

Its a 4 bed (and I think 4 en suites with electric shower) det house and was totally refurbished and extended in 2002 by a reputable local builder, there is a workshop, a green house and 2 garages all with their own CU with RCD. Existing electrical paperwork dated Nov 2002 and Feb 2003.

 

[flameport]

The bill is made up of 1 day for 2 people at £265, £10 certificate fee and £45 admin plus VAT making a total of £572.75.

Excessive even for that size of house. The certificate/report is part of the job and should not be billed as a separate item. The £45 could well be what the estate agent added on themselves?

17 pages - all done in triple extra large print and 4 inch margins all round presumably?

If there are documents for the installation from 2002/3, there is no reason for a PIR anyway, unless there have been undocumented alterations since then.

 

[SUNRAY]

The bill is made up of 1 day for 2 people at £265, £10 certificate fee and £45 admin plus VAT making a total of £572.75.

Excessive even for that size of house. The certificate/report is part of the job and should not be billed as a separate item. The £45 could well be what the estate agent added on themselves?

17 pages - all done in triple extra large print and 4 inch margins all round presumably?

If there are documents for the installation from 2002/3, there is no reason for a PIR anyway, unless there have been undocumented alterations since then.

I totally agree with you, I haven't seen the report or the bill, all described over the phone so I dont have too much detail. I believe I have done the only alterations, changing the FCU's to single sockets for fridge, washing m/c etc etc when they moved in about 3 years ago (previous owners simply cut the cables leaving live stubs when the CU was turned on).

My initial (and still current) reaction when I heard about the bill was to tell them to get s*u*f*d especially as the estate agent said nothing about the the new report or suitability of the old certs.

From memory I think the 2003 related to the outbuildings and 2002 the house.

 

[Adam_151]

I haven't seen the paperwork, apparently it consists of 17 pages

17 Pages seems a tad excessive for a domestic PIR, either there is lots of separate DBs, or lots of faults reported?

certainly supprised that an estate agent comissioned PIR is that long I'm lead to believe that what they want a lot of the time is a short PIR that fails to spot anything that might put the buyer off...

 

[ban-all-sheds]

you have to anticipate your needs the night before..

Fnarr, fnarr...

The bill is made up of 1 day for 2 people at £265, £10 certificate fee and £45 admin plus VAT making a total of £572.75.

Excessive even for that size of house.

Don't forget the owners were away, so those 2 people had to fit in TV watching, beer drinking and rummaging through wifey's underwear drawer as well as doing the PIR....