Landlords DIY Electrics

[tonyb69]

Hi there,

I'm new to this forum but have a question about my landlords DIY electrics.

So basically he has managed to wire an extension lead to the light junction box in the kitchen pantry.

The lead is not controlled by the light switch, it is permanently live and just sort of hangs there in the cupboard. I'm not an expert but I'm not sure this complies with any sort of electrical regulations, however the property did receive an electrical safety certificate.

Is it me or is this dangerous?

Thanks in advance for your advice.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Do you know that it is on a lighting circuit? The fact that there is a light on it does not guarantee this.

There is nothing unsafe, per se, with a socket on a lighting circuit, but the way that that one has been done, with inadequate cable restraints, is not right.

 

[tonyb69]

Thanks for your reply.

To be honest I've not gone back to the fuse box to work out which circuit the light and extension socket are on, I was a little surprised this complies with UK regulation.

The property also one of the bedrooms fed with a 5m extension lead plugged into a neighbouring room with the cable through the wall.

There's also feature lighting in a staircase, the wires being contained in a plastic box and just hanging down freely from the top of the stairs (see below)

However if your view is this is perfectly ok for a rented accommodation then I thank you for your opinion, I just assumed there were more health and safety regulations these days to prevent landlords and DIY electrics.

Cheers

 

[bernardgreen]

Dangerous on two counts

Electically it is a socket into which a 3 kW ( 13 amp current ) appliance could be plugged, the lighting circuit is not designed to carry that much current so ( hopefully ) has a 6 amp MCB protecting it. The appliance would cause the MCB to trop putting out most if not all the lights.

Physically the lead to the plug is not secured to the wall. If ( when ) it is tugged then the connections in the junction box will be put under strain and may ( probably will ) come apart.

The "electrician" (?) who issued the safety certificate was in error if he did not say it was not to BS7671 standard and indicate to the landlord and the tenant that it was non compliant.

EDIT after seeing the wiring on the stairs.

The landlord needs to be taken to task over that stair case wiring. It is dangerous electrically and as a possible trip hazard on the stairs.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I never said it was OK, just that there is nothing necessarily dangerous about having a socket on a lighting circuit.

The way that that one has been installed does not appear to be compliant because of the lack of cable restraints.

An extension lead running through a wall is not necessarily dangerous, nor non-compliant (except for the regulation requiring good workmanship, but that's always a "personal opinion" one).

The lighting etc on the stairs is messy, could be a trip hazard, could be dangerous, and is certainly badly done.

If the Electrical Installation Condition Report makes no mention of any of these things then either it was done by a friend of the landlord, or by someone not fit to do inspections, or both.

And I'm not sure that those stairs comply with the Building Regulations either.


If this is being let through an agent I suggest you take the photos to him and express your concerns.

Basically what you can see are things done by someone who either did not know how to do it properly or didn't care. So what else has the buffoon done that you can't see?

Find somewhere else to rent.

 

[tonyb69]

Re the Spiral Staircase, the maximum opening allowed on a staircase is 99mm (the 100mm sphere rule), this staircase has 270mm openings in the balustrades and 170mm between treads. The agents responsible for this property says the staircase may have been built before the regs came into force therefore it doesn't fall under the care of duty of the landlord. Interestingly you can see where the current owner (landlord) removed parts of the balustrade to allow them to fit their feature lighting (the small dot you can see on the side edge of each tread), as they only bought the property in 2007 and with the 100mm sphere regulation being in force for over 25 years, their modification was non building reg compliant. Having said that even with the modified construction and electrics on the stairs the council are not interested unless someone has a serious injury or worse.

Re electrics (see below), another example in the house of the landlords electrician skills hidden behind a door. This forms part of the feature lighting on the main staircase, these wires go into the wall (just above the top of the picture) to the feature lighting in the wall at the top of the stairs. There's about 20m of cables wrapped up there in that bundle, which then runs under the carpet and is plugged into the wall. I was finally sent the electricians report last week that was completed prior to the commencement of my lease, interestingly they did not examine the extension lead wired into the junction box in the kitchen nor the feature lighting on the main and spiral staircase, they only PAT tested the cooker, hob and dishwasher, that was it, so much for a landlord having to have the electrics checked before commencement of a lease.

 

[securespark]

Cables under carpets is bad news...

 

[TheVictorian]

The socket in the cupboard is dodgy and should be something more permanent.

The low voltage cables for the LED lighting are a mess but that could all easily be removed.

 

[tonyb69]

Dear Victorian, yes the LED cables are a mess and with around 50m in total of LED cables I would have expected a landlord to have made them safe or removed them prior to my lease commencing. The same for the socket in the cupboard, although no electrical certification is required the landlord has a legal duty to ensure the electrics within the property are safe prior to the commencement of any tenancy, in this case they did not.

Re the comment you deleted about the stairs, the staircase was indeed build within building regs but has subsequently been modified by the landlord to allow for his LED feature lighting, what you do in your own home is your own business, if however you want to rent out your property you have a care of duty to your tenants and in this instance not only is the staircase dangerous in its current state there are metres upon metres of cables hanging from it, a small child (of which I have 2 that currently cannot visit due to a whole host of reasons in the property) could easily hang themselves from it.

I pay £1,350 a month for a house that even the letting agent in their recent report detailed 7 issues as dangerous and which the landlord has not made any effort to remedy.

Being a landlord carries responsibility and a care of duty to your tenant, I have no issue with good landlords, unfortunately there are those who feel they are above the law or it does not apply to them.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Why did you move in?

 

[tonyb69]

I visited the property in October last year and the landlord was living in the property at the time, I signed in November with a move in date in January. Most of the issues you couldn't see until they moved out and it wasn't until I got the keys and realised the state they left it in I objected to the Agents who basically said you have a contract so tough.

 

[securespark]

I don't think they can call "tough" on a contract when the landlord has left the property in a dangerous condition.

Find out who your local council's Tenancy Relations Officer is and ask them if they can help. If not, they will know who else to ask for help.

 

[OwainDIYer]

The agents responsible for this property says the staircase may have been built before the regs came into force therefore it doesn't fall under the care of duty of the landlord.

The agents are lying. (They do that.) The property must be safe to be rented and the landlord has a duty of care regardless. It doesn't matter whether it was built in 1970 or 1790 and building regs have changed since. It doesn't have to comply with current building regs but it must be safe. The danger is not just a child falling off the stairs, but falling through the gap and getting its head stuck and strangling to death.

Contact local council private housing enforcement officer or Shelter Helpline.

 

[SimonH2]

...so much for a landlord having to have the electrics checked before commencement of a lease.

There is no such requirement. There IS a requirement that the property be "safe", and any sensible landlord would have an inspection done as much as a CYA process as anything else.

 

[ericmark]

Why did you move in?

That was also my thoughts. I remember buying my first house, it was clearly not complete and my solicitor as one might expect simply said you don't more in until completed. Moving in then hoping the landlord can get some one to correct after the hand over is not going to happen.

If the landlord or letting agent does their job correctly they simply say sorry there has been an oversight find alternative accommodation until we can correct, as to who pays the bill for alternative accommodation depends on the contract, but I am sure it's not what you want.

The courts I am sure would support you, the the death of Thirza Whittall it typical of court cases, they fined and blamed Hilary Thompson for letting the property before doing any repairs required, but dying to make the point is a little drastic.

£5000 fine is not much when you consider how much is made from the property per month. Likely less than a years rent. Now you have moved in you have a fight on your hands, which will likely mean solicitors to show you gave them enough time to correct the errors before moving out, the law did help the tenant, it stopped rent rises, and required a standard for the house to be considered habitable. But there was a lack of rented accommodation and now the rules seem to have gone full circle allowing the landlord to get rid of tenants much easier.

It's all well and good us saying that does not follow regulations, but we don't have to live there, or worry about the landlord evicting us because it has been pointed out the house is below standard.